Official Languages Committee on Oct. 9th, 2025

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

You don't want to comment?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

The last member to ask questions is Mr. Deschênes‑Thériault.

You have the floor for five minutes, Mr. Deschênes‑Thériault.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

We know that priorities can change when there's a change in government. Since 2015, early childhood has been a priority in Ottawa. That was reflected in the 2018 and 2023 action plans in particular, where there was an increase in the amounts granted to the francophone early childhood sector.

However, as Ms. Asselin said in her opening remarks, the issue of francophone early childhood wasn't a priority for the government in 2013, and it really fell under the radar at the time. Given the importance of early childhood in the French-language education continuum, what could the federal government do to better protect that essential hub?

I would like to get an answer from Ms. Asselin.

[Marie-Andrée Asselin]

I think a lot of it has to do with the funding structure. Take the shortage of educators, for example. We want to support educators so that they finish their schooling in early childhood education. We want to support future educators in the credential recognition process. In British Columbia, credential recognition is particularly difficult. It's long-term work; we're talking about years of support to complete an educational journey in early childhood education.

We're very grateful for the training funding that the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne, or ACUFC, received. I was talking about the Network of Early Childhood Stakeholders, or NECS, and the $47.7 million for the Commission nationale des parents francophones, or CNPF, and its network. We're very pleased with that funding, but what will happen after that, in 2028? What will happen to the educators we're currently supporting in their educational journeys? What will happen to the project to build new child care centres after 2028? It isn't easy to know, and the current circumstances are creating a lot of uncertainty when it comes to our momentum right now.

Three-year agreements aren't enough. The action plan for official languages normally lasts five years. We've now reached the third year, and we've just gotten the funding. If we'd had access to this funding in the first year of the action plan for official languages 2023–2028, we could at least have had five years to roll out programs and services, and we would have had a better impact.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you.

I'd like to take you in a different direction.

Earlier, one of my colleagues mentioned that the current government wants to increase the proportion of francophone immigration to 12% by 2029. Increasing francophone immigration was a long-standing request from the communities, and it was well received.

How will this increase in francophone immigration help you in terms of the labour shortage, particularly in the early childhood or education sectors?

My question is for Ms. Asselin and Mr. Dion.

[Marie-Andrée Asselin]

Immigration is very important for us in British Columbia. We aren't able to staff positions in the francophonie, even outside of schools and early childhood, without bringing in people from abroad.

Access to credential recognition is still a problem in the whole issue of francophone mobility, since the processes are long and quite tedious for people who want to immigrate to Canada. I would say that we're very happy with the targets, that's great, but there are still a number of barriers to the arrival of those skilled people, who want to come and work with us.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you.

Mr. Dion, do you have an answer?

[Daniel Dion]

On the Saskatchewan side, it's really like what Ms. Asselin described.

We're grateful to be able to welcome more and more teachers. We want a certain percentage of people who immigrate to our province to be teachers.

As Ms. Asselin said, one of the major challenges is the recognition of these teachers' diplomas and education training. There's still work to be done to ensure a smooth transition for teaching in minority environments.

It's important to remember that it isn't easy, that this situation involves subtleties and its own challenges, which can be quite a shock for someone who's used to working in a francophone majority environment and who arrives in a francophone minority community in Saskatchewan.

These people should receive a great deal of support, whether professionally or in terms of the offer for the students who'll be coming to our schools.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Thank you, Mr. Deschênes-Thériault.

That concludes today's testimony. On behalf of the committee, thank you, Mr. Dion, Ms. Asselin, Mr. Krajewski, Mr. Desgagné and Mr. Leclerc. Since the committee will now be dealing with two administrative matters, you may disconnect.

Colleagues, as I mentioned at the beginning of the meeting, we're now going to take some time to discuss two items. First, four budgets have been distributed to committee members: the one for the study on the education continuum, the one for the study on the renewal of the employment contract for interpreters, the one for the briefing with the President of the Treasury Board and the one for the briefing with the Minister of Canadian Identity and Culture and Minister responsible for Official Languages.

Is there unanimous consent to adopt these budgets?

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Can you just remind us of the amount for each study? It seems minimal to me.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Yes. I'll ask the clerk to respond to that.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Madeleine Martin]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The briefing with the President of the Treasury Board is just one meeting, so the amount is $500. That will be used to provide a meal. The same goes for the briefing with the minister responsible for official languages.

As for the study on the renewal of the employment contract for parliamentary interpreters, which took place last Tuesday, the budget is $5,500. That includes witnesses' travel expenses and meals.

The budget for the study on the minority-language education continuum is $41,900. That's the biggest of the four budgets, because witnesses will be coming from all over Canada. There will be some from Halifax, Calgary, Vancouver, Victoria, Edmonton, Iqaluit, Montreal, Quebec City, Toronto and Winnipeg. We went off the witness list.

We also planned for headsets for witnesses participating virtually in the meeting, as well as 10 working meals, since, in addition to the six meetings devoted to the study, there will be other meetings to study the report. We also have to take into account the costs associated with those meetings.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Is that too much or too little? What options do we have? I don't see any. We have to do these studies, so I think it's just a formality.

[The Clerk]

Yes. That's why the planned spending is based on where the witnesses are located. For those attending the meeting in person, we use the list of witnesses to calculate travel expenses based on their location. For example, the representatives of the Commission scolaire francophone du Nunavut are coming to testify in person, so I included their travel expenses in the budget. The budget is calculated based on fixed amounts. For example, the House of Commons determines how much it costs, on average, to bring in witnesses from Vancouver, and that's the amount that gets budgeted.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Wasn't there an overall budget in previous years? I don't recall voting on a budget for each meeting.

I also imagine that the costs are lower for witnesses who prefer to testify by Zoom, right? You seem to have already calculated the travel expenses for those appearing in person, in any case.

[The Clerk]

In terms of the cost of headsets compared to the number of in-person participants, since it's impossible to know in advance how many people will testify in person and how many will do so virtually, I divide the number of witnesses according to a certain ratio to provide funding for both types of participants.

As far as study budgets are concerned, we do indeed have to adopt a budget for each study. That's always the standard.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Mr. Dalton, you have the floor.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

First, if more witnesses decided to travel here, would our ability to welcome them be limited or could we simply increase the budget?

Second, have you ever had a discussion with them as to whether they intend to come here?

Finally, what is the cost of the headsets?

[The Clerk]

They're good questions. A headset costs $250, but it can be less. Sometimes witnesses buy their own headsets and are reimbursed up to $250. So it can cost them $50 or $70.

To answer the question about overall budgets and the overall envelope, I'll give you some examples. If we adopted an amount of $41,900, then that amount would be allocated to this study. However, how it would be spent would depend on the variables that were mentioned. We can spend more on witnesses who attend the meeting in person. It doesn't have to be exactly 12 headsets or 18 witnesses participating in person. If we didn't spend all the money, what would remain would go back into the committee's overall envelope. So the money wouldn't be wasted. It would stay with the committee and be used for a future study.

We usually prefer to err on the side of caution by adopting a slightly higher amount, which avoids making supplementary estimates should there be a lack of funds. In such a case, it would be possible to prepare supplementary estimates. By adopting a higher amount, we can put the money back into the committee's overall envelope if we don't use it all, even if it means using it at another time.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Witnesses can purchase their headsets according to the established standards. However, as we saw today, someone had problems. You said that it probably wasn't due to the headset, but to his computer system. They have to follow guidelines in order to get a refund. Is that correct?

[The Clerk]

Yes.

There is also a very strict list of permitted headsets. The IT ambassadors, who are not often seen but are at the back of the room, can see on the computer whether the witness has connected with the right headset. If the witnesses don't have the right headset, they aren't even allowed to access the meeting on Zoom. It's the same as for you, by the way. When you are appearing virtually, we always make sure you have the right headset before letting you access the meeting on Zoom.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

We will continue with Mr. Villeneuve, who will be followed by Mr. Beaulieu.