Official Languages Committee on Oct. 30th, 2025

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

I want to go back to a discussion we had earlier. You recommend that section 41 of part VII of the Official Languages Act give full power to the federal government. We're indeed very concerned about the fact that education is a provincial jurisdiction. My colleague was talking about the reality in Quebec.

In that context, have you discussed your proposal with your colleagues in the other provinces? How socially acceptable is such a recommendation?

What would be the challenges and real benefits of giving the federal government full power, instead of continuing to work with the provinces to get there?

[Ronald Ajavon]

You've asked an essential question.

In my discussions with the provincial representatives, we always look at the pie chart for the province. It's never a question of refusing one thing or saying there shouldn't be access to another thing. In that context, if the federal government has a positive obligation when it's ready to announce funding, the province will never say no. That means there has to be some kind of tripartite agreement between the province, the school boards and the federal government to address the issue of funding. Otherwise, we'll be going around in circles for a number of years, and our children will still have the same challenges as what we're discussing around this table.

This approach was actually adopted in the health field, for example, and it took nothing away from that area of provincial jurisdiction. It would also take nothing away from provincial jurisdiction over education. In fact, it would be a good support.

Like all our other colleagues across the country, what we want is access to services and schools, including local schools. We also all want to have access to fair funding and real equivalence. Our proposal would enable us to get all of that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Thank you very much, Ms. Chenette. Your time is up.

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I have a first question for you, Ms. Lachance.

You said that your schools were allocated $60 per francophone, whereas the national average was about $150. Can you explain a bit more about what those numbers correspond to?

[Nathalie Lachance]

They correspond to the funding we receive from the federal government per francophone. That reflects a bigger problem for Alberta's francophonie, because we've had a growing francophone population for a long time, but the funding formulas haven't kept pace with the rapid growth of the Franco-Albertan population.

Alberta is a province that attracts a lot of people. In fact, 24% of francophones in Alberta have been living there for a number of decades. Some francophone families have been living there for 200 years. In addition, 40% of francophones come from elsewhere in Canada, like me, and 32% were born abroad. For us to have such a diverse francophonie today, we've experienced very rapid growth. Our population has doubled in recent years. The funding formulas haven't kept up, though, as is the case with all the education funding agreements.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

As a result, the current funding agreements allocate almost twice as much money to anglophone students as to francophone students.

[Nathalie Lachance]

It isn't a comparison between francophones and anglophones; it's a comparison between francophones across the country. Ms. Laurin can correct me if I've misunderstood, but it's a matter of comparing how much funding the federal government provides per student across the country.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

The federal government gives less funding to francophones in Alberta than those elsewhere, then. Is that correct?

[Nathalie Lachance]

That's correct. It's because the funding formulas haven't been adapted to the growth of Alberta's francophonie.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Perfect, thank you.

My next question is for you, Mr. Fiola.

For a very long time, francophones outside Quebec have fought to have institutions run by and for francophones. There is now the Université de l'Ontario français, which is developing, but I know that a number of bilingual universities lobbied to prevent the creation of that university.

Do you think it's important to have universities run by and for francophones?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

I'm sorry, Mr. Beaulieu, but your time is up. I will allow the witness to answer if he can do so very quickly, or you can continue this discussion during your next turn.

[Marco Fiola]

I think that services offered by and for francophones have their place. I represent a bilingual university, and I've formed partnerships with unilingual French-language universities in Ontario. I happily welcome the arrival of those universities. They're additional players on the chessboard for defending French and bilingualism in Ontario.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Thank you.

Mr. Dalton, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much to the witnesses. It's a pleasure to hear from them. My francophone roots are in Alberta. I'm Métis, from a family that's lived in Alberta for 200 years. My mother's name is Beaudoin, and she comes from a family of 18 children, so I think I'm related to half of the francophones in Alberta.

Is the number of francophones attending primary schools, secondary schools or early childhood centres stable, declining or increasing?

[Nathalie Lachance]

In terms of kindergarten to grade 12, around 10,000 students are enrolled in the 45 French-language schools of the province's four French-language school boards. That figure is growing, though, so it doesn't reflect the significant needs. The latest Statistics Canada census indicates that the province has 75,000 rights holders under the age of 18. I know that some of them aren't of school age, but that still puts us in second place for the largest francophone population outside Quebec. Ontario is number one, and then it's us. There are even more rights holders in Alberta than in New Brunswick.

I don't have the figures for early childhood, but my colleague Ms. Laurin could provide them. These are really urgent needs. We have what we call child care deserts. Across the province, there are places without any French-language services available. That has a very significant impact on young people and families. That's often why, after day care, parents enrol their children in English-language schools.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Okay.

Can you tell us a bit about the importance of francophone immigration in Alberta?

[Nathalie Lachance]

Francophone immigration is very important in Alberta. We have the benefit of a well diversified, but also inclusive, francophonie. Thirty‑two per cent of Albertan francophones were born outside the country, and two‑thirds of those immigrants come from Africa.

That means that Alberta's francophone immigration profile is different from the province's immigration profile; 23% of Albertans were born outside the country, and Southeast Asia is the main source of immigration to the province. Our immigrant population is different. Immigrants who arrive in our francophone communities come from the African continent, speak French and integrate very well into our structures and schools. We can count on the participation of a huge number of families or community members of African descent, as well as Caribbean, in some cases. I'm thinking of Haiti, for example.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Thank you very much.

Like the other witnesses, you talked about federal underfunding. The amount you receive is stable, but would inflation, the rising living costs and wages that aren't keeping pace be the cause of all this pressure? Could you elaborate on that?

The representatives from the other organizations can also speak afterward.

[Nathalie Lachance]

In that regard, I would agree with my colleague from Saskatchewan. Underfunding has been going on for a very long time, and we're constantly playing catch-up. However, for us to be able to catch up as needed, it's important to speed up the process, which isn't happening. I'm thinking of school construction, for example. Every provincial budget announces the construction of one or two schools in a province, but we need more than that. In Edmonton, the school board had to wait 20 years to get a new school. Before then, all we had were schools that had been donated by other school boards and renovated. [Technical difficulty—Editor], there really are gaps.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Ms. Lachance, I'm sorry to interrupt, but we're having technical difficulties once again, and the interpreters unfortunately can't interpret what you're saying. Would it be possible to ask Ms. Laurin to answer on behalf of the ACFA?

Just to be clear, Mr. Dalton, I stopped the clock during the technical difficulties. You now have one minute.

You have the floor to answer the question, Ms. Laurin.

[Isabelle Laurin, Executive Director, Association canadienne-française de l'Alberta]

I'm sorry, I've lost track. What was the question?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Mr. Dalton, can you repeat the question? I'll stop the clock while you do that, and I'll restart it when Ms. Laurin begins her answer.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

I was saying that even if federal funding increased, the fact remains that inflation, the rising cost of living and wages that aren't keeping pace are the main cause of all this pressure, aren't they?

[Isabelle Laurin]

To Ms. Lachance's point, I'd say that Alberta is struggling to get schools built. As she said, it took 20 years to get a new French-language school in Edmonton. In the past, we had only old schools that other English-language school boards had given us.

The cost of living obviously has a huge impact. As we've already said, the growth and diversity of Alberta's francophonie create new needs for services in our French-language schools, which also require financial support.

[Marc Dalton, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Thank you very much.