Evidence of meeting #75 for Public Accounts in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was projects.
A video is available from Parliament.
Auditor General, Office of the Auditor General
For 2020, coverage in rural and remote areas was 97.2%.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Can you read the percentage of Canadians with access to cell coverage in rural and remote areas in 2021?
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
That means, according to this information, that cell coverage in rural and remote regions had actually gotten worse since 2020. Is that correct?
Auditor General, Office of the Auditor General
That's what the data that we audited identified, yes.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Thank you.
Mr. Kennedy, telecom companies are required to provide data on their cellular coverage to the government. Is this correct?
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
I'll turn to my colleague Mr. Dagenais, who can speak to the reporting requirements.
Éric Dagenais Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Spectrum and Telecommunications Sector, Department of Industry
The reporting requirements are to the CRTC, and we are working with the CRTC and with telecom firms to get better coverage data. We have some, but we're working on improvements as per the Auditor General's recommendation.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
They are required to provide data. That's correct.
Ms. Hogan, in your report you stated that cellphone coverage data was not verified. You stated that the CRTC does not verify the data on mobile service coverage that they receive. You also stated that the department does not verify the mobile cell service data they receive. That means the cell coverage data submitted to the government has not been verified.
I find this very concerning. If the government is actually claiming that over 96% of Canadians in rural and remote regions have access to mobile services, but the government is not verifying all this information, could this data and could these reports be actually inaccurate and inflated?
Auditor General, Office of the Auditor General
There's always a possibility when no one kicks the tires or challenges the information or looks for anomalies that there are errors in data, which is why we recommended that information shouldn't just be taken in good faith and that you should at least do some vetting of that information. We can only take what the government had, analyze it and give you those details, but it's an excellent practice to vet the information you receive from third parties.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Do you find it kind of concerning? Before we started the committee here, we noted that everybody has complaints about cellphone service in Canada. If it's not cost, it's definitely reliability and serviceability, especially in rural Canada. When you come to rural Canada, the government's telling you one thing—“Look, don't worry. Everything's fine. Everything's okay. We're connecting you. We're spending billions of dollars”—yet no one is verifying that. The reality is that they're not being covered.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Thank you, Mr. Mazier. I'm afraid that is your time, but I see that we'll be coming back to you shortly.
Ms. Yip, you have the floor for six minutes. Go ahead, please.
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
Thank you, Chair.
I live in the city and I sometimes have connectivity problems with the Internet as well as the cellphone. I move an inch this way and my call gets dropped. I can only imagine how those who live in rural and remote areas must feel.
My question is directed to Mr. Kennedy.
There is a plan to connect 98% of Canadians to high-speed Internet by 2026 and 100% by 2030. Are you on track to reach these goals?
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
At the moment we are on track. The first goal was in 2021. That goal was exceeded, and we're expecting to meet the next goal, which is in 2026. There's no evidence to suggest we will fall short of that one. The 2030 goal of 100% of Canadians covered is obviously further away. There will need to be additional technologies and resources to actually hit the 100%, but we are confident about getting to 98% by 2026.
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
What percentage of Canadians are connected to high-speed Internet today compared to what it was, let's say, 10 years ago?
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
If we go back even just five years, about 86% of all households would have been connected to high-speed broadband.
I should make a distinction because the focus of the universal broadband fund, and indeed the focus of the audit, is on wireline broadband access, not cellular coverage. We agree that cellular coverage is important, but the statistics I'm citing are for wireline Internet.
In 2018, it was 86% of households. We project that by the end of the year we'll be at 94.6% coverage. By 2026 we project 98% plus, perhaps a little higher, but certainly we will exceed the 98% coverage target for wireline Internet service.
Liberal
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
If I could maybe just provide a brief overview, there's been just over $3 billion—
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
I'm sorry, but could you just ask Mr. McCauley...? I can hear the competing voices.
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
Through the universal broadband fund, for example, there's been just over $3 billion of federal money allocated to support closing the gap, largely in rural, remote and indigenous communities, because that's where the market hasn't readily served those communities.
When the government announced the universal broadband fund, a number of provinces stepped up virtually immediately to pledge to match the federal money. Quebec is a good example of that. Shortly after the UBF was announced, Quebec said they actually wished to spend significant resources and to partner with the federal government to basically extend fibre optic coverage in Quebec. As of today, Quebec has full coverage of fibre optic broadband Internet service.
The UBF money, the federal money, the $3 billion, has been matched by a couple of million dollars of provincial money and we are—
Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Spectrum and Telecommunications Sector, Department of Industry
It's $5 billion, private and provincial.
Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
Yes, it's $5 billion in private and provincial dollars, so it's $8 billion in total.
We have signed a memorandum of understanding with a number of provincial governments to try to coordinate our investments, so we're basically focusing on projects that we all agree are important, making sure that we combine our efforts and so on. There are hundreds of projects that have been authorized to date. There are technical staff in my organization who track each project and track the milestones. The senior executives have quarterly meetings with the large telephone companies to take stock of progress and see how things are going.
We're very confident at this point that most of these major projects are on schedule and will be completed in the remaining year or two before we get to the 2026 deadline.
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
What can we learn from the success of Quebec in terms of working with other provinces to achieve their results?