Public Safety Committee on Feb. 27th, 2020

[Rob Morrison, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Is there a calibre? For example, is a semi-automatic in that classification?

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

It may be, but not necessarily all semi-automatics. Again, I would refer you back to.... When I say “military-designed”, I think that's a very important part of this discussion. So, that's weapons that were designed for use by soldiers—not for hunting and not for sporting activity, but for soldiers—to kill enemy combatants. Weapons that were designed for that purpose, I believe, should be used exclusively for that purpose. They have no place in a civil society. We've seen some tragic instances in Canada and also around the world—

[Rob Morrison, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Thank you, Minister.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

—where such weapons have been used because of their efficiency in killing people.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

I was rather hopeful that we could have some nexus to what the study is, but you've been very disappointing, Mr. Morrison.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

Not to me, Mr. Chair. I want you to put that on the record.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Okay.

Mr. Iacono.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I also want to thank the minister for being here this morning.

Minister, I often hear my constituents say they are concerned about the threat posed by money laundering. The fact that criminals launder money through illegal means is unacceptable because it increases the cost of living for Canadians. To ensure that those who break the law are identified and receive the appropriate punishment, it is essential to support law enforcement on this.

Unfortunately, we know what the Conservatives did for the 10 years that they were in power. They made cuts to the RCMP, which was not spared.

In budget 2019 and the supplementary estimates, we are investing where it counts.

Minister, can you tell us how we are going to enhance capacity and support our front-line operations?

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

Thank you very much.

First of all, let me say that money laundering is a significant priority for our government, and it's a priority for me. I worked in this area for a very long period of time.

If I may, instead of reflecting back on things that have happened in the past, closing out integrated proceeds of crime units, etc., I'd like to think about how we go forward. I've had a number of discussions with B.C. officials, for example the Attorney General David Eby. Dr. Peter German, who was formerly the commanding officer in British Columbia, has done a very comprehensive report for them and identified some key areas where improvements can be made. We've been working very closely with them.

Let me give you some examples.

Because it is a budget discussion, in budget 2019, we announced $68.9 million in a program, which involves $20 million ongoing, to fund the RCMP to strengthen their federal policing capacity, including their capacity to combat money laundering.

We have announced additional money to form an information management and information technology infrastructure and digital tools to provide our law enforcement officials with the resources and access to the technologies they need.

Also, we brought forward measures in the budget implementation act last year—significant and important measures—to reduce the opaque nature of beneficial ownership in federally regulated corporations, for example.

One of the things that organized crime and money launderers hate is sunshine by creating transparency. We also convened a meeting with financial ministers from across the country, because the vast majority, more than 90%, of corporations are regulated by provinces. We're working with all the provinces to bring about a greater transparency to beneficial ownership, which will help those investigations.

Additionally, we also brought forward measures in the budget implementation act to create a new offence of recklessness. We know that police services across the country were having difficulty—and prosecutors particularly were having difficulty—in making the nexus between the proceeds of crime and the predicating offence. We've made those criminals more vulnerable to investigation and prosecution.

There's a great deal more work to do, but we are working with our provincial partners and with our federal authorities through the RCMP's leadership. It's a whole-of-government effort, to make it more difficult for individuals to money launder in this country. Organized crime is entirely motivated by profit. When we take that profit from them, we reduce the impact of organized crime for all Canadians.

Thank you very much. That was an important question.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Minister.

My next question is for Commissioner Lucki.

Safety is everyone's business. I know that every party feels that way. The supplementary estimates for 2019-20 provide a transfer of nearly $789,000 from the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness to the Royal Canadian Mounted Police to combat drug-impaired driving.

Can you talk about the spending that will come with that transfer and how that spending will help in better protecting Canadians and combatting drug-impaired driving?

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

I know you directed the question to the commissioner, but if I may, I'd like an opportunity to speak to this.

We saw, for example, that there were significant deficiencies in the law with respect to drug-impaired driving. It's been an offence to drive while impaired by drugs in this country since 1923. Up until the introduction and implementation of Bill C-46 in the last Parliament, the police did not have the authorities or access to the technologies or the training they needed to enforce these laws, and to therefore deter and detect these offences and successfully prosecute them.

We've made very significant investments in a number of areas, specifically for the police. We've provided additional resources, not just for the RCMP but for police right across the country, to increase the number of officers. We've nearly doubled the number of officers trained as drug recognition experts, who are necessary in the investigation and prosecution of these offences. We have additionally made significant investments in police officers in every part of the country. They have been trained in what's called “standardized field sobriety testing” so that every police officer is empowered to do this.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Mr. Blair, we're going to have to leave the answer there, unfortunately.

I'm sure you'll be able to come back to that, Mr. Iacono.

Mr. Shipley, you have five minutes, please.

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Blair, for being here today.

We had a set of questions ready to go yesterday, but I had an email this morning that I read on my computer before I walked over here, so I'm going to change it up.

A constituent asked me a question that I didn't know the answer to, and this was quite an interesting question. Obviously, we're all here today to make sure you have the proper resources to ensure national security. The constituent asked if I knew the definition of “terrorist activity” according to the Criminal Code.

Are you aware of what that is, Mr. Blair?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

I'm going to let the minister answer the question, but does this have some relation to the—

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Yes. They want to make sure they have enough money to enforce that statute. I have it right here so I can read it for you.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Okay. Maybe help out the minister then. It's good.

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Sure.

(b) an act or omission, in or outside Canada,

(i) that is committed

(A) in whole or in part for a political, religious or ideological purpose, objective or cause, and

(B) in whole or in part with the intention of intimidating the public, or a segment of the public, with regard to its security, including its economic security, or compelling a person, a government or a domestic or an international organization to do or to refrain from doing any act, whether the public or the person, government or organization is inside or outside Canada

That's the definition. This resident wanted to know if the current illegal blockades that have been happening across Canada are being deemed a terrorist activity.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

No, they are not.

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

What would they fall under? Why would they not have the intention of intimidating the public or segment of the public with regard to its security?

They wanted to know that. When I looked it up myself, I was curious.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

It's one of the challenges of people who read legislation. It's how the law is applied and defined by our courts and by the police.

The important work of protecting Canada, the work we do globally and domestically in dealing with terrorist activity, is critically important, but as well in this country, there is a protected right in the Constitution for lawful, peaceful protest. When that protest becomes unlawful, as can be the case either in violation of an injunction or as a result of specific criminal activity, our officials don't make the immediate nexus to terrorism in criminal activity.

Our officials are well versed in their responsibilities, and the determination as to what conduct might constitute a specific criminal offence is not something that I as a minister of government would direct. That's a determination made under the individual discretion of the police of jurisdiction in exercising their responsibilities to conduct investigation and the responsibilities of prosecutors of jurisdiction.

I would not leap to that determination but leave it to the police and to our prosecutors to determine whether or not any conduct meets a threshold of that level of criminality.

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

I definitely agree with proper civil demonstrations. I'm all for that. But when we're seeing certain things like I saw yesterday with burning goods on rail lines across Canada, I thought that may have crossed the line. Exactly where are we determining what's crossing the line then, Minister?

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

Again, I have to be a little careful. I was asked this question yesterday, Mr. Shipley. As the minister, I do have a responsibility to leave it to the police of jurisdiction and the exercise of their discretion to determine and investigate criminal activity, so I avoid pronouncements in defining that activity in respect to the Criminal Code. I think it's very appropriate that I be careful in doing that, because I do not want to interfere with the operational independence of both the police and our prosecutors. At the same time, that was terribly unsafe, deeply concerning. I have confidence in the police to deal with it appropriately.

[Doug Shipley, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

I agree.

I will give my last minute to Mr. Paul-Hus.

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Shipley.

Minister, on Tuesday, the correctional investigator was unequivocal with the committee. He took the time to tell us that he believes that the internal investigation commissioned by the government was ineffective and inadequate and that an external investigation in the death of Marylène Levesque was needed.

Why are you refusing to launch an external investigation?