Yes.
Evidence of meeting #85 for Public Safety and National Security in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was transfer.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #85 for Public Safety and National Security in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was transfer.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Thank you.
Going into my final round, I'll note that, at page iv of the review report into the Bernardo transfer, the fourth paragraph outlines that, after his June 2022 rejection, he applied in July 2022, after he had integrated into his unit.
At that time, it said:
Information provided to the Review Committee indicated that, after the offender had applied for a transfer—
Then it's redacted.
—the Office of the Correctional Investigator (OCI) initiated informal discussions concerning his security classification, to ensure compliance with the “least restrictive measures” principle and legal requirements, as per the CCRA.
What is your understanding of the Office of the Correctional Investigator's intervention with regard to the security reclassification of Paul Bernardo and his rights under the principle of “least restrictive measures”?
12:35 p.m.
Commissioner, Correctional Service of Canada
Ivan is gone.
I can't speak to that. That discussion would have been done at the local level.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
The review report indicated that the OCI had concerns about whether or not his security classification was appropriate. He was here earlier. He suggested he was concerned about the timeline. He wanted it done in 60 days. He was concerned that the Correctional Service wasn't getting it done on the timeline. However, it said that he “initiated informal discussions”. I want to know what those informal discussions were, regarding Correctional Service Canada's “compliance with the 'least restrictive measures' principle and legal requirements”.
What were those discussions?
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Okay.
I would also like to confirm this, as per my previous request: Could those be deposited by January 15 with the clerk? Is that enough time for you to deposit those previous commitments?
12:35 p.m.
Commissioner, Correctional Service of Canada
Those reports you requested...by January 15?
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Thank you.
It seems to me that the Office of the Correctional Investigator got involved in July 2022. However, the report said there was a previous ongoing investigation by the Office of the Correctional Investigator.
What was the nature of that investigation in relation to Paul Bernardo?
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Did the Office of the Correctional Investigator make known to you that it was doing an investigation? Did it make inquiries with regard to Paul Bernardo's security classification process?
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Can you commit that your office, barring any confidentiality requirements, will share that information with this committee to determine the nature of these investigations and the Office of the Correctional Investigator's concerns in launching this investigation?
12:35 p.m.
Commissioner, Correctional Service of Canada
Do you mean whether we received any correspondence?
12:35 p.m.
Commissioner, Correctional Service of Canada
Like I said, I don't know of any, but—
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
12:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Heath MacDonald
Thank you, Mr. Lloyd.
Thank you, Ms. Kelly.
We are now moving on to Mr. Schiefke.
12:35 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Schiefke Liberal Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank our witnesses for being here today and also add my thoughts for the families of the victims of Mr. Bernardo.
I'm going to dedicate most of my questions to you, Ms. Kelly. My first question is with regard to the maximum penalty under Canadian law. That was applied to Mr. Bernardo. Is that correct?
12:40 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Schiefke Liberal Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC
Since he's been incarcerated, he has been, for the last 30 years, in maximum security. Is that correct?
12:40 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Schiefke Liberal Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC
Okay.
In your opening remarks, you commented on actuarial tools and the actuarial scale that you use in determining whether or not an inmate is transferred. Can you give me three factors, out of all the factors that you use, in determining whether or not one should be transferred from maximum security to medium security?
12:40 p.m.
Commissioner, Correctional Service of Canada
First of all, it's very important to say that the actuarial tools help anchor the clinical judgment of the parole officer. It's really a tool to assist.
We look at institutional adjustment and any incidents, escape history, street stability, alcohol or drug use, age at the time of sentencing, number of prior convictions, severity of the current offence, sentence length and breaches of conditions.