Public Safety Committee on Feb. 17th, 2022

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I was just wondering about this because it does make a difference to how many potential victims there could be. I'll move on.

One of our previous witnesses in the first hour was Mr. Christian Pearce, who is a criminal defence lawyer. He has represented many clients who have been involved in firearms crimes. I know we've had a lot of conversations on the illegal firearms trade. These are smuggled weapons, and they were illegal to begin with, but there is also a very real problem with legal firearms that are being illegally diverted.

Criminal organizations in the past have targeted firearms shops, vendors and so on. What more can we be doing to ensure that legal firearms are not being illegally diverted into the hands of criminal organizations?

[Matthew Hipwell]

That falls under the licensing aspects for private individuals, making sure that the licensing processes are in place and that these individuals are fully vetted and firearms owners get vetted daily.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Are you satisfied that we have enough security measures in place to protect the stock of legal firearms so that they are not as tempting a target to criminal organizations?

[Matthew Hipwell]

Yes, there are lots of deterrents in there, but it comes down to accountability. If we're going to water down offences and punishments for those who contravene the law, then we're losing part of that. If there's no deterrent and there are no repercussions, there's no accountability and we're losing out on a big part of that. Watering down the offences and taking away those mandatory minimums for these violent offences is not helping deter—

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I will note that there is no evidence showing that mandatory minimums decrease crime. Furthermore, there are relevant sections in the Criminal Code that allow judges to increase or decrease a sentence based on severity and aggravating factors.

Chief Inspector Bertrand, I'll move to you.

We have had other law enforcement officials talk at great length about the link between the illegal drug trade and the illegal firearms trade. Certainly Vancouver police have identified how the high profitability of the drug trade in Vancouver has led to an explosion of firearms use amongst gangs.

Can you, please, in the remaining 45 seconds, inform this committee a little bit more about Montreal's experience in this regard?

[David Bertrand]

Yes, there is still a connection between drug trafficking and firearms possession or trafficking. We must remember that the more money or drugs people have, the more protection they need. We've been seeing this recently with drug theft. People want to protect themselves, they don't want to be attacked, so they carry guns. People also use guns for intimidation and to protect their territory, of course.

As I was also saying, you must remember that they use the same routes. So, yes, there is still a connection between drug trafficking and firearms possession.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

Thank you very much.

I would like to thank the witnesses for their testimony this morning. It's been very helpful. Your experience and insights help inform the committee. On behalf of the committee and all parliamentarians, thank you for the work you do and for sharing your insights with us.

Colleagues, we will now suspend the public portion of the meeting and reconvene to meet in camera. Please use the in camera link that was provided to you. I'll see you in a few minutes.

Thank you.

[Proceedings continue in camera]