Status of Women Committee on Nov. 17th, 2020

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number four of the House of Commons Standing Committee on the Status of Women.

Today's meeting is taking place in hybrid format, pursuant to the House order of September 23, 2020. The proceedings will be made available via the House of Commons website. The webcast will always show the person speaking rather than the entirety of the committee.

With regard to the speaking list, the clerk and I will do the best we can to maintain a consolidated order of speaking for all members, whether they are appearing virtually or in person.

I would ask committee members as well to join the meetings 15 minutes early in the future so that the technicians can do all the sound checks and we can always get started on time.

Today our study is on the impacts of the COVID-19 pandemic on women.

For the benefit of our new witnesses, before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. When you are ready to speak, you can click on the microphone icon to activate your mike. All comments should be addressed through the chair. Interpretation in this video conference will be very much like in regular committee meetings. At the bottom of your screen, you have the choice of “English”, “French” or “floor”. “Floor” gives you whatever is being spoken. When speaking, speak slowly and clearly so that the translators can do their work. When not speaking, your mike should be on mute.

Now I'd like to welcome our witnesses, who will begin their discussions with five minutes of opening remarks.

We have today, from Pink Attitude Evolution, Ruby Dhillon, founder, president and board chairperson, and Jaspreet Sandhu, executive producer and officer, national research study.

We also have, from Réseau FADOQ, Ms. Tassé-Goodman, president, and Mr. Poirier-Monette.

We'll start with Pink Attitude Evolution.

Go ahead, Ruby.

[Ruby Dhillon, Founder, President and Board Chairperson, Pink Attitude Evolution]

Good morning.

Thank you, Madam Chair, vice-chairs and committee members. It is a pleasure to be here today.

My name is Ruby Dhillon. I am the founder and president of Pink Attitude Evolution. I'm joined here today by my fellow officer and executive producer, Jaspreet Sandhu.

Pink Attitude Evolution is a not-for-profit organization in Canada with a mandate to empower South Asian women to achieve their full potential in their chosen endeavours. To ensure that we make an impact at the most pivotal point in their lives and to stay connected throughout their journeys, we selected four cohorts to focus on: high school students, post-secondary students, middle-management professionals and finally the next chapter, which we've coined as women entering the workforce for the first time, re-entering it or just pursuing a new career.

Our focus is to curate annual programming, support initiatives and build partnerships that will provide meaningful value to our cohorts, such as mentorship and scholarships.

Today, we're grateful to have this opportunity to share preliminary insights on our latest initiative in partnership with CultureIQ: a national research study to understand how to unlock the true potential of South Asian women in the workforce and why this group is vital to Canada's economic future.

Holistically, our preliminary research indicates that the face of the Canadian workforce is quickly changing. South Asian women will be integral to its future.

We know this by making a note of the demographics, specifically the rate of natural increase. The Canadian population is heading towards a net-zero birth rate by 2034, coupled with a lagging rate of replacement of retirees, resulting in the shrinking of our national labour market.

However, it's quite contrary to what we observed in the South Asian population, which continues to grow and is the single largest visible minority group in Canada. In particular, the South Asian female population continues to increase year over year, while the non-visible minority female population has remained basically flat.

In addition, the growth is further strengthened by immigration, and we want to highlight international students in particular. We know that Canada has one of the highest rates of international students from South Asia. At the end of 2019, there were over 200,000 students from India alone.

What's important to recognize here is that a vast majority of them will remain in Canada to work and gain their Canadian permanent residency. Needless to say, there is a strong presence of South Asians in the workforce.

Beyond the shifting of population demographics, South Asian women are among the most highly skilled minority groups in Canada, underscoring a clear message that they're vital to drive the overall population growth and the national economy.

However, it's concerning that there are serious implications ahead of us if we continue to ignore statistics and do not address the challenges that prevent us from utilizing this highly skilled and untapped workforce.

I'd like to now pass it on to my colleague, Jaspreet Sandhu, who will go further into the findings and the positive outcomes.

[Jaspreet Sandhu, Executive Producer and Officer, National Research Study, Pink Attitude Evolution]

Good morning.

Right now South Asian women are disproportionately affected by COVID-19, with higher underemployment and unemployment rates. As the economy continues to be hit hard, the unemployment rate swelled to 11.3% in July 2020. However, the national unemployment rate disguises significant variation across population groups.

It is important to highlight that the highest figure within the unemployment rate is among South Asian women, at 20.4%. What we don't know is why South Asian women are being disproportionately affected.

It is also worth nothing that prior to the COVID-19 pandemic, the unemployment rate still did not favour South Asian women. The 2016 census highlighted the unemployment rate to be 11.14%. Again this statistic is disproportionately high in comparison to other women. We did not expect to find these alarming statistics. In taking the next steps to examine why this is happening, we may be tempted to jump to certain conclusions.

Our preliminary findings lead us to a very confusing picture. We have learned that South Asian women are in their prime working years and are highly educated, especially in comparison to other visible and non-visible minorities. To detail this, South Asian women are a decade younger than their counterparts at a median age of 33, and 37% of South Asian women have a university degree, which is the highest in comparison to any other group of women, including both visible and non-visible minorities.

Anecdotally, through our network of partners, we know that South Asian women in COVID-19 are taking on work that they can get, dealing with possible discriminatory layoffs, having an increase in cases of homelessness and a rise in domestic violence, and are forsaking their careers to take on familial duties.

In response to the impacts of COVID, the disproportionate employment rate and changing population, Pink Attitude Evolution is focused on collecting better data to produce targeted recommendations and meaningful actions through our national study. Upon completion of the study, Pink Attitude Evolution will initiate a cross-country national outreach plan to ensure South Asian women, employers, educators and other not-for-profits engage in the findings to positively impact employment rates.

Our goal is simple. We will build tangible programs and initiatives to improve the employment rate for South Asian women.

Our call to action for the Government of Canada can be summarized in three simple points. One, we would like to see the Government of Canada's partnership to support the study. Two, we anticipate changes in policy to specifically serve South Asian women—not just general programs for women. Three, we expect COVID-19 recovery plans to seriously consider South Asian women, as they are a well-prepared group of powerful women who can easily fill gaps in the Canadian economic market.

Thank you for your time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

Excellent.

Now we go to Gisèle Tassé-Goodman for five minutes.

[Gisèle Tassé-Goodman, President, Provincial Secretariat, Réseau FADOQ]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Members of the Committee, I am Gisèle Tassé-Goodman, President of Réseau FADOQ. With me today is Philippe Poirier-Monette, our organization’s collective rights adviser. I would like to thank the members of the Committee for inviting us.

Réseau FADOQ represents people age 50 and older and has more than 550,000 members. Our goal in all our presentations to legislators is to help improve seniors’ quality of life. People are more financially vulnerable now than before the pandemic. Many older women must rely solely on Old Age Security and the Guaranteed Income Supplement to support themselves in retirement.

Let’s not forget that a few years ago, women often withdrew completely from the labour market to care for their homes and families. However, someone who receives only Old Age Security and the Guaranteed Income Supplement has an annual income of less than $19,000. Older women in this situation barely meet the threshold set by the Market Basket Measure, the MBM.

It is important to remember that the Market Basket Measure does not include some items that are essential to seniors’ independence, and that the pandemic has increased seniors’ expenses. That is why Réseau FADOQ believes that the Guaranteed Income Supplement must be increased by at least $50 per month, per senior.

In addition, the Government of Canada needs to keep its election promise to increase Old Age Security benefits by 10%. Our organization also proposes that this increase apply as of age 65 to all seniors eligible for the Old Age Security pension.

Even with these needed increases, the support provided by the Old Age Security program seems to be eroding. Old Age Security and the Guaranteed Income Supplement increase annually based on inflation, yet wages usually increase at a higher rate. Given this gap, federal benefits will play an increasingly smaller role in the future as an income replacement tool in retirement. Réseau FADOQ suggests that the federal government index Old Age Security benefits based on wage growth.

A recent study conducted for the Regroupement des aidants naturels du Québec showed that during lockdown, 20% of informal caregivers saw an increase in expenses related to their role. These additional expenses were $890 on average but as high as $6,000 in some cases. As you probably know, women are more likely to become informal caregivers. Our organization recommends increasing the tax credit for informal caregivers and making it a refundable tax credit.

Lastly, we would like to address the health care situation in Canada. Federal health transfers totalled $37 billion in 2017–2018, while total expenditures were $167 billion. According to the Conference Board of Canada, the federal proportion of health care funding will drop by at least 20% by 2026. Réseau FADOQ recommends indexing the Canada Health Transfer by 6% annually and including a variable in the current formula to account for the aging population in the provinces and territories.

Let’s not forget that nurses, personal support workers and informal caregivers are predominantly women and that they suffer the most from a lack of health care funding.

I would like to thank the Committee members for their attention.

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

Thank you very much.

We will now begin our round of questions.

Each person will have six minutes for the questions. I'll try to be kind when I cut you off when you get to the end and I say, “It's your time.”

We're going to start with Jag Sahota for six minutes.

[Jag Sahota, Conservative, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Hello, everyone.

Thank you to the witnesses for being here and for your presentations.

My question is for Pink Attitude Evolution. You guys talked about the unemployment rate being 20%-plus among South Asian women, despite the fact that they are very educated, have their degrees and are much younger. My question is this: How, if at all, has the pandemic induced an economic downturn that is affecting South Asian women differently from men?

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

I can take that question.

What we're finding is that South Asian women are taking manufacturing jobs or other types of employment to get by, or we're finding people being laid off. I don't have the specific numbers. That's what we want to dig into.

[Jag Sahota, Conservative, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Okay.

The next question is also for Pink Attitude Evolution. I heard a lot from my constituents, women of South Asian descent, who operated small businesses. Because of the rules surrounding many of the government programs, such as the wage subsidy, they did not qualify for the programs, particularly at the beginning. The government did end up amending the rules after we Conservatives raised these concerns in the House.

What has your experience been? Among the South Asian women entrepreneurs you work with, what have you heard on the challenges COVID has presented and on the government's response to those challenges?

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

Ruby, you can jump in as well, but I will take this again.

It's exactly as you described. We're finding many self-employed business owners struggling, and again finding alternative work as well. We're also finding that people are taking on multiple jobs at this time, just because they can either lose the income in their households or are shutting down their businesses during this time and relying on the support of the government where they can. However, ultimately these women want to get back to their businesses, especially since they've built them from the ground up, and they're worried about whether they'll have a business to return to or work to return to.

The theme we generally find is that these women will find whatever work they can get. They unfortunately will take roles that don't necessarily fit their qualifications. They'll have superior qualifications, but they're very worried about food security, house security, all those things, so they will, again, find more menial work in other places. That's where you're seeing some of the trends of exposure to COVID as well, and infection rates within the community, because they're taking other types of work.

[Jag Sahota, Conservative, Calgary Skyview, AB]

To elaborate on that, maybe you can talk a bit about how older South Asian women are affected differently by COVID than the younger ones.

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

I actually don't have a clear sightline into that. What we want to see through our study is whether the education rate shifts by age as well. Are they new immigrants or first generation among certain demographics?

What we do know is that there are a lot of intergenerational households and that there is then added pressure around who is bringing income, as well as who is taking care of the family in terms of the caregiving work that needs to happen.

I'm sorry I can't give you a statistic around that right now. I really wish I could.

Ruby, do you have any other insights to add here?

[Ruby Dhillon]

No, I think you've nailed it.

In terms of the elderly generation, we're finding from our networks that a lot of them live in intergenerational families. We're still trying to get some data around that so we can specify to you where the barriers lie. That is why we stress that this national study is really important for us: It's so that we don't come up with solutions out of the air but have some tangible stuff to look at, and we can then act on that accordingly.

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

Anecdotally, I'll give you examples.

There are many people who have been taking on work that they typically wouldn't have, say in manufacturing or other fields, and are using grandparents, for instance, as day care and dropping off their kids there, or even having them within the household bubbles. In terms of the exposure risk to senior South Asian women—grandparents and all of that—they're being relied on in that networked family for child care during this time, because it's falling to one place or another. That's anecdotally what we've seen.

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

I will now turn the floor over to Mr. Serré for six minutes.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thanks to the witnesses for the information they have provided. This will definitely help us as a government in amending some of our policies.

My first question is for Ms. Dhillon and Ms. Sandhu.

We know that women have been disproportionately hurt by the pandemic in terms of jobs, and you mentioned this. I want to assure you that our government has applied the GBA+ lens on budgeting and on a lot of the programs and legislation that we've had. Since March, we've also been tweaking, making changes to some of our programs to adjust them. I want to thank you for your input.

Recently we announced the action plan for women in the economy. That's a task force that will help especially on the intersectional component here, on the gendered lens.

As my first question, do you have any specific recommendations for that task force, moving forward?

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

Yes. I think when we're looking at the unemployment rates overall, a blanket approach may not be supportive of what's happening. That, I think, is our message today.

I think we need a little bit more information about what is happening. Is it discriminatory layoffs, for instance, right now? Is the unemployment rate higher for South Asian[Technical difficulty—Editor]

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you. We're having a hard time—

[Jaspreet Sandhu]

[Technical difficulty—Editor] educated women to get back into [Technical difficulty—Editor]

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Madam Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

Yes, I understand. I'll add some time for you.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you.

I also wanted to ask you this, Ms. Dhillon. We recently announced $15 million for women entrepreneurs. Minister Ng just recently announced this. Do you have any comments or suggestions on how we could specifically gear some of those dollars more on the intersectional lens and gender for women entrepreneurs?

[Ruby Dhillon]

Yes, absolutely. I want to echo what Jaspreet had said. We can't have a blanket approach and we need to make sure that we understand that this is a substantial group in terms of a population standpoint and also from an unemployment standpoint.

I think it could be really easily resolved, because this group is highly educated, highly skilled, and can easily adapt and be marketable instantaneously. I think it's just somebody taking a lens and looking at them and standing behind something that we're doing, like our study, to give you guys some tangible action to help elevate this group forward.

If anybody looks at it from a top-down perspective, as Jaspreet mentioned in her remarks, they'll see that they're a decade younger than all visible minorities. They're young, they're highly skilled, and they're educated. It's a really easy solution, I just think we need to make sure we don't do a blanket approach with them.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you. After your testimony today—both of you—if you have some specific recommendations to send to the clerk and to our chair to inform our report, that would be greatly appreciated.

I also wanted to thank you on the South Asian international students. In my riding of Sudbury, we have over 2,000 international students. It's so important for our community, for employment and moving forward, to attract more international students.

I have about two minutes left. My next question is for Ms. Tassé-Goodman.

As you know, the Prime Minister has met with the provincial premiers to discuss national standards for long-term care centres. I don't believe the provinces have made any proposals regarding those standards.

If you were a representative of one of the provinces, what sort of recommendation would you make on the subject of national standards for long-term care centres?

I would appreciate it if you could answer me in a minute or less.

[Gisèle Tassé-Goodman]

You know as I do that this is a provincial jurisdiction. So we won't venture into that area since it isn't a federal matter.

However, we would prefer a focus on health transfers because we know there's a shortfall in that area. I'll invite my colleague Mr. Poirier-Monette to provide a few details on the subject.