Evidence of meeting #75 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 41st Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was projects.
A video is available from Parliament.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Fort McMurray Airport Authority
The strategy should come first.
NDP
Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON
—and we have in this committee discussed the idea of a long-term strategy, but unfortunately the other side has said that they don't want to have a strategy. It is difficult for us to go forward when there is a reluctant partner not willing to have a strategy in regard to how it spends its infrastructure money.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Fort McMurray Airport Authority
I'll choose not to comment on that. It sounds like it's a problem.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Your time has expired, Mr. Sullivan. I don't think I heard a question in there.
Mr. Preston, welcome to the committee.
Conservative
Joe Preston Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
Thank you. It's great to be here. It has been a while.
Certainly, I'll lead off with Mr. Sullivan's last strategy question. As a business person my whole life, and we're talking about competition here today, I love competition.
First of all, I love competition in the things I buy because it means I can increase the quality of the things I buy and lower the price of the things I buy, because there's more than one person trying to offer it to me. On the other side of the equation, as a business person I love competition because I love to say that as long as one of my competitors is still doing $1 in sales, I have room for growth, because by being better than him, I can take the business.
That's really all we're talking about here in infrastructure, and the competition level in infrastructure. It's not about who it is. I don't think about who the competitor is. I think about whether I can get a better price for a higher-quality piece of goods.
Would either of you disagree with what we're saying? That's all we're trying to say here. Whether it's municipal, provincial, or federal dollars, it all comes out of one taxpayer's wallet. Why would we ever not want to spend that dollar as thinly as we possibly can?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Fort McMurray Airport Authority
Hear, hear.
Conservative
Joe Preston Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
Right.
We talked about P3s. I like to think of myself as a P1. I don't have to have the public-private partnership. As a private businessman, I can make those types of decisions. It's seldom in the P3 situation that the private business part gets in the way of the success of it. It's quite often the “let's add government to the mix and see what happens”.
I'll leave it at that, but I just really wanted to make clear that what we're talking about here is spending money wisely, when there are fewer dollars to spend wisely.
Thank you.
Conservative
Conservative
Joe Preston Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
Would somebody like some of my time?
Maybe Mr. Taylor wants to answer my question.
Director, National Citizens Coalition
I'd like to add testimony to clarify perhaps some of the concerns from Mr. McGuinty and from Mr. Holder regarding my remarks on unions and their relationship with government.
I think when you have a closed system and when it benefits a few players within that system, we have seen examples where those favoured few that are allowed to play do work with and enable and even help elect governments that help them. I know there are examples in Ontario, for example, where this has happened.
That is really just what I was referring to, and if that generates any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them.
NDP
Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
For Mr. Taylor, essentially, when it comes to infrastructure spending, you're advocating that with regard to the end result of the spending, this government, when it sets aside some money, put some strings attached to that money. One of the strings should be that there is some kind of open process, so that the municipality wouldn't get the money if it didn't have an open process.
Director, National Citizens Coalition
Yes. I hope that whatever power the government has over the dispensation of money that it allocates to the provinces, it suggests to those provinces that they create an open and fair bidding system.
NDP
Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON
Your statistical analysis left me a little bit woozy in terms of trying to get to the same numbers you got to. You suggested that with 31% of the private sector organized, somehow seven out of 10 Canadians are not able to work.
Director, National Citizens Coalition
Well, within a closed system that excludes—
Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON
Right, within a closed system. Are those seven out of 10 Canadians qualified? Are you suggesting that somehow we've expanded the ability for somebody to be a skilled tradesman, for example, to seven out of 10 Canadians? Clearly that's not the case.
Director, National Citizens Coalition
These statistics, of course, are according to human resources on the government's website. While 30% of the workforce is unionized, the pool of qualified workers is shrinking over time and this just exacerbates the problem.
NDP
Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON
Right. Okay.
Mr. Clements, one of the suggestions from the federal government more recently is that when there are infrastructure dollars to be spent by the federal government, a good thing would be to create apprenticeships with the money.
In my riding, we've discovered that the non-union contractor that was used by one of the provincial crowns doesn't want to have apprentices. We've been trying very hard to get an apprenticeship program going with a $2.5 billion infrastructure spend, and we're not having any success. Unionized workforces tend to have a robust system of apprenticeships. If the government is suggesting that apprenticeships be a part of their infrastructure spend, that would be a good thing, particularly in a place like Fort McMurray, where skilled workers are hard to find.
