Transport Committee on April 22nd, 2021

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thanks, Chair. I'll put it over to my colleague Mr. Iacono.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Rogers.

Go ahead, Mr. Iacono.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, hon. colleague.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome, Madam Minister.

I'm not surprised that the former leader of the Conservative Party is criticizing our infrastructure investments, since he proposed during the 2019 election campaign to stretch those investments out for three more years, which would have reduced them by $18 billion. Let me repeat that: $18 billion. That certainly would have delayed or reduced infrastructure projects across Canada. I don't think he needs to lecture us today.

Madam Minister, in our role as MPs, we are seeing all the pressure that COVID-19 is putting on municipalities. Our government has supported them since the crisis began, and we want to provide additional support through the federal gas tax fund.

Could you tell us more about this measure and the timeline for its implementation?

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Go ahead, Minister.

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I thank my colleague very much for his question.

We know how important it is to invest in infrastructure. As you said, these are really tough times for municipalities. The investments they make are really important, which is why we've doubled our investment in the federal gas tax fund. As I said, this fund has a new name, which I think is more appropriate: the Canada community-building fund. It's a $1.36 billion investment, and that money goes directly to municipalities. So it works differently than our infrastructure program where we work in partnership with the provinces and territories. What municipal mayors need is the money to invest in infrastructure that will improve living conditions in our communities. They want the flexibility to make those investments. If you talk to the mayors, you'll see that there are a lot of important projects.

Last year, we announced investments. It's normally done in two parts, but this time we invested the money in one go. That's one of the differences. It's really important to listen to the mayors of the communities, to know their needs and to support them. We need them to invest in infrastructure that will make a significant difference in the quality of life of Canadians.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Madam Minister, I've talked to the mayors and municipal representatives, and they're very pleased that you haven't just paid out money from this fund in the past year, but also that it's been doubled. This has been a huge help. I'm very proud to say that I represent this government, along with my colleague Mr. El-Khoury. We're seeing a big difference here. It's important to point out that 10 years ago, there weren't many infrastructure projects in my riding or in the riding of Laval—Les Îles. It's thanks to our government that this has changed.

Thank you again.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Iacono.

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Let me say that doubling the fund has brought it to $2.2 billion. That's a lot of money. It's double the amount we were giving before.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

We're now going to move on to the Bloc.

Mr. Barsalou-Duval, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My question is for Ms. McKenna.

In the recent budget, your government announced close to $500 million for the HFR, or high-frequency rail, linking Quebec City and Toronto.

Of that $500 million, how much will be spent on the portion between Montreal and Quebec City?

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Thank you very much for the question.

I hope you are happy with the investments we've made in child care. I know you have a child, and I hope things are going well for you. You may even have two now.

High-frequency rail is a very important project. I'm working not only with the Minister of Transport, but also with the Canada Infrastructure Bank. In the budget, as you saw, we invested in high-frequency rail. These investments are for the entire route, so that the project can move forward. That is very important. That said, I recognize the importance of connecting Montreal to Quebec City and including all the stops.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Minister, but I wanted to know how much of the $500 million will be invested in the portion between Montreal and Quebec City.

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I don't know the exact amount. It's a major project. The investments are for the entire project. Of course, the route between Montreal and Quebec City is important.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

You can understand my surprise. It seems to me that $500 million is substantial enough to know what will be done with it when it's allocated.

According to their comments, elected officials, mayors and chambers of commerce in the Mauricie region don't seem to be very happy with this $500 million. We all know that the HFR project doesn't cost $500 million, but rather $5 billion to $10 billion. You're saying it's good news, but the Regroupement des chambres de commerce de la Mauricie as well as the mayors of Trois-Rivières and Quebec City are all disappointed with your government's announcement. Why are you the only ones who are so happy about it?

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

They shouldn't be disappointed because these investments show that we want to move the project forward. Our various departments are working very hard on this. The Canada Infrastructure Bank is instrumental in attracting private investment. Of course, there is more work to be done, such as determining the route and exploring the technology. That said, this is an important project not just for Quebec, but also for all the people who live in the planned corridor. It's also good for the economy and good for jobs.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Madam Minister, do you know how many kilometres of railway track between Montreal and Quebec City belong to VIA Rail? None. VIA Rail doesn't own a single kilometre of track between Montreal and Quebec City.

Under the circumstances, I wonder how you're going to do a HFR project with $500 million. Everyone knows that's not going to happen. Also, it's $500 million over six years. So that means that it will be $100 million a year and that there won't be any new investment for six years.

Since the election campaign before last, the Liberals have been telling us that the HFR is coming and that they believe it. Finally, people are beginning to believe it less and less and to think that it's just a bit of window dressing. In six years, it will be in 2027, and there will still be no HFR.

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I'm going to turn it over to the deputy minister because I know she's working hard on this project with Transport Canada. The project is being led primarily by Transport Canada and the Canada Infrastructure Bank.

Ms. Gillis, could you talk a bit about the project?

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Go ahead, Ms. Gillis.

[Kelly Gillis]

Yes, thank you.

The budget provides a small amount to allow the joint project office to continue its work on the HFR. There's also an investment of nearly $500 million, as was mentioned, to maintain VIA Rail's services at an appropriate level and to support any infrastructure projects designed to promote the success of the HFR. Yes, it's over six years, but it's really to reduce bottlenecks, and to improve flow and connectivity with respect to VIA Rail's existing services.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Yes, it's to reduce congestion. I understand what you're telling me, but what I mainly understand is that this $500 million will be used to improve VIA Rail's services, in order to perhaps also promote the HFR project.

In the end, a HFR is not being announced at all, but rather a little money for renovations. There are no HFR tracks between Montreal and Quebec City. However, that's what the mayors and chambers of commerce are asking for, and that's what your government has been promising since the election before last. In 2027, there will still be nothing. That's the reality.

I think that's why elected representatives from the Mauricie region and chambers of commerce throughout over Quebec are disappointed with your government. They feel abandoned. While you promised them something, you're not giving it to them.

[Catherine McKenna, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I see that this is a very important project for the hon. member. As mentioned in the budget, we are moving forward, making investments and working hard on it. We need to have all the details on the technology, the exact route and the costs. We need to know how to attract private sector investment. I know we're working very hard on it. The joint project office, which is under the shared responsibility of the Canada Infrastructure Bank and VIA Rail, is working with Transport Canada and Infrastructure Canada on this project.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister and Mr. Barsalou-Duval.

We're now going to move on to the NDP.

Mr. Bachrach, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome back to our committee, Minister McKenna.

I'd like to start with the Auditor General's recent report on the Investing in Canada infrastructure program.

Minister, her high-level findings on the program and its effectiveness are pretty troubling. I imagine they were frustrating for you to read. I'll read a sentence from the section entitled “Overall message”. She states, “Overall, Infrastructure Canada—as the lead department for the Investing in Canada Plan—was unable to provide meaningful public reporting on the plan’s overall progress toward its expected results.”

How can Canadians trust that these massive investments are advancing the goals that you've laid out when even the Auditor General of Canada can't connect the dots?

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Go ahead, Minister.