Transport Committee on Nov. 5th, 2020

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Welcome to meeting number three of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities.

Today’s meeting is taking place in a hybrid format. It's our opportunity to speak with the minister, as well as to ask questions of the minister and have some time with him. I will be asking the clerk how much time we will have upon completion of my comments.

I would like to start this meeting by providing you with some information, following the motion that was adopted in the House on Wednesday, September 23. The committee is now sitting in a hybrid format, meaning that members can participate either in person or by video conference. All members, regardless of their method of participation, will be counted for the purpose of quorum. The committee’s power is to sit; however, this is limited by the priority use of House resources, which is determined by the whips. All questions must be decided by a recorded vote, unless the committee disposes of them with unanimous consent or on division.

Finally, to ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline a few rules to follow throughout the meeting.

For those participating virtually, members may speak in the official language of their choice. Interpretation services are available for this meeting. You have the choice, at the bottom of your screen, of either “Floor”, “English” or “French”. Before speaking, click on the microphone icon to activate your mike. When you are done speaking, please put your mike on mute to minimize any interference.

All comments by members and witnesses should be addressed through the chair. Should members need to request the floor outside of their designated time for questions, they should activate their mike and state that they have a point of order. If a member wishes to intervene on a point of order that has been raised by another member, the member should use the “raise hand” function. This will signal to the chair your interest to speak and create a speakers list. In order to do so, you should click on “Participants” at the bottom of the screen. When the list pops up, you will see next to your name that you can click to raise your hand.

When speaking, please speak slowly and clearly. Unless there are exceptional circumstances, the use of headsets—as you all know—with a boom microphone is mandatory for everyone participating remotely. Should any technical challenges arise, please advise me. Please note that we may need to suspend a few minutes as we need to ensure all members are able to fully participate in this meeting.

For those participating in person, proceed as you usually would when the committee is meeting in person in a committee room. Keep in mind the directives from the Board of Internal Economy regarding masking and health protocols. Should you wish to get my attention, signal the clerk with a hand gesture, or at an appropriate time, call out my name. Should you wish to raise a point of order, wait for the appropriate time and indicate to me clearly that you wish to raise a point of order.

With regard to a speaking list, the committee clerk and I will do the best we can to maintain the consolidated order of speaking for all members, whether they are participating virtually or in person.

Let's move on to the order of the day.

I am happy to welcome today Minister Garneau and his officials from the Department of Transport for the consideration of the main estimates 2020-21 and the supplementary estimates (B), 2020-21.

I will remind all members that the supplementary estimates (A) were adopted by the House on June 17, 2020, and were not referred to this committee. The supplementary estimates (B), 2020-21, were tabled in the House and referred to standing committees on Thursday, October 22, 2020. They can be found on the Treasury Board website.

Pursuant to Standing Order 81(5), each committee may “consider and...report, or shall be deemed to have reported,” the votes in the supplementary estimates (B) “not later than three sitting days before the final sitting” of the supply period ending not later than December 10, or “three sitting days before the...allotted day in the current period”, which has not been allotted as of yet. May I suggest that we report them back to the House at the same time as the main estimates? The deadline is Friday, November 27.

Once again, we welcome Minister Garneau.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

Of course, as a result of the subsequent points of order after question period and then the votes, we now see the clock at 4:14, unfortunately.

I just want to have the assurance that we will have the minister for the full hour, as well as the department following the minister for the full hour.

We're dealing with both the supplementary estimates and the main estimates here. Unfortunately, due to the timing, we missed the opportunity in the spring and the summer since we weren't sitting at that time. There certainly are issues of great importance before the entire Canadian economy at this time.

I'm hoping to get the assurance that we will, in fact, have the minister for an entire hour and his departmental colleagues for a full hour following that.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Ms. Kusie. I will finish my remarks, because I was about to mention that.

Welcome, Minister Garneau.

Minister Garneau will be with us for the first hour only, but his officials will remain with us for the second hour to answer questions from members of the committee.

I want to confirm with the clerk that we will have the available resources until a certain time. Mr. Clerk, if you could answer before I go to the minister, what time that will be, we would all appreciate it.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Michel Marcotte]

I asked all the services. I'm still waiting for answers. I'll come back to you as soon as I have clearance from everybody. Technically we should be able to, but I'll let you know.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Clerk.

Minister Garneau, the floor is now yours.

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Minister of Transport]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I am pleased to appear before the Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities and answer questions today on supplementary estimates (B) 2020-21. I would like to take this opportunity to welcome all the new members of this committee.

Thank you for the opportunity to speak to you today.

There is no doubt that the COVID-19 pandemic is having a profound impact on Canada's transportation system, as well as the work of Transport Canada. Much has changed since the beginning of the pandemic and we have had to adapt to the situation. However, other priorities and responsibilities still need to be addressed.

The supplementary estimates (B) for the 2020-21 fiscal year include items that required adjustments for a variety of reasons. For example, the COVID-19 pandemic created an unprecedented crisis in remote communities that rely on aviation. Air travel is the only safe and reliable way to reach a number of communities for much of the year. Air travel is a lifeline for them. It provides an important link to people and services.

While necessary restrictions on travel have kept many remote communities safe, they have also contributed to a 90% decline in revenues for our smallest air carriers. Many of these carriers are owned and operated by the first nation and Inuit communities they serve.

The supplementary estimates (B) include support for a new contribution program to support air carriers that provide service to remote communities. These communities must have access to essential air services for food, medical supplies and other necessary goods and services.

We must also ensure that our communities can be connected to our vital transportation networks.

Last year, Transport Canada announced plans for a new, permanent replacement for the MS Madeleine, the ferry that provides service between Îles-de-la-Madeleine, Quebec, and Souris, Prince Edward Island. The current vessel is 39 years old, and is at the end of its service life. However, designing and building the replacement vessel will take several years.

Supplementary estimates (B) include funds for purchasing a temporary replacement vessel, to ensure that efficient ferry services will continue until the new vessel is ready. When that new vessel is ready, the temporary replacement will be put up for sale. This delivers proper value to taxpayers, in addition to ensuring service will continue in the short term.

The Speech from the Throne emphasized that, as we work through this global pandemic crisis, we must build back better together.

The Speech from the Throne also indicated that the Government of Canada is committed to making zero-emission vehicles more affordable and accessible. Canadians’ quality of life and Canada’s future growth are deeply connected to the environment. We need to invest in a cleaner and more sustainable future to protect the things that Canadians rely on for their success: an affordable cost of living; good, well-paying jobs; and resilient communities.

The supplementary estimates (B) include additional resources for the incentives for the zero-emission vehicles program to help meet Canada’s zero-emission vehicle sales targets.

While certain circumstances may have changed and certain priorities have been magnified, our goals remain the same.

As the Speech from the Throne pointed out, the pandemic's economic impact on Canadians has already been more significant than the 2008 financial crisis, and the consequences will not be short-lived. We must take action now, for the sake of Canadians now, and in the future. This is not the time for austerity.

We have an opportunity to take action—with smart, targeted investments, as we continue to do through the national trade corridors fund, which also has dedicated funding in this year's supplementary estimates (B).

This is a time for building stronger communities, and a more resilient economy. This is a time for building a healthy, sustainable future for Canadians.

Thank you for your attention, and I am ready to take your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

We will start off with Ms. Kusie for six minutes.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Minister. It's always a pleasure to see you.

I'm just going to start this meeting with a bang. The cat is out of the bag. After eight months, the Financial Post is reporting that you will finally have a plan for airline sector. It comes, finally, after losing between $27 billion and $37 billion of GDP, after losing 400,000 to 500,000 jobs in this sector, after all other G7 nations gave a median of $30 billion to their sectors before us, after Canada lost 14% of our transatlantic share, and after rapid testing was implemented by the private sector at YYZ and YVR, when that should have been the lead of your government.

Most importantly, Minister, it's after families have been crying and calling me because they have lost their jobs. They didn't know how they were going to provide livelihoods for their families. It's after CEOs of airlines were phoning me saying they felt devastated laying off workers and wondered how they were going to face their employees day after day. It is after families were sending me photos of themselves in their uniforms with their children, Minister.

Why has it taken you and your government eight long months to respond to the airline sector and provide them this week with what we hope is finally a plan?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

Thank you very much for the question.

For a bit of historical context, when this pandemic started back last winter, our government's energies were focused on helping Canadians. We came up rapidly with programs like the emergency response benefit and the wage supplement, measures to help with rent and measures to help small businesses and seniors, etc.

Since that time, of course, we have evolved. At the time, we had no idea how serious this pandemic would be or how long it would last. Now, over the intervening months we have been able to get a good sense of how much this has impacted the air sector. You are right. It certainly has impacted the air sector in many ways, chiefly because they have lost approximately 90% of their revenues. That is why, as I have indicated many times in the past few weeks, we have been working on a set of measures that are focused on ensuring that when we come out of this pandemic—and during the time that we are in it—we will still be able to have an air sector that is viable, affordable and safe.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you, Minister.

I have been very proud to act as their advocate during the time that I have been shadow minister for the transport minister. Today, as you go to announce your plan, I will continue to act their advocate.

Minister, can you assure me on this call today, in this meeting today, that you will include within your plan protection for workers so that when this money is issued there will be no further layoffs in the airline sector? Will that be a part of your plan for the funds that will be provided to the airline sector? Can you assure us that there will be no more layoffs when you give this money, please?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

Let me say first of all, Ms. Kusie, I have no problem with your questions. You are doing your job, which is to ask those questions.

I can tell you that we are looking at a series of measures. Those measures do include the workers who have been affected. I have met with the unions. I have spoken to them. I have heard their concerns. I met with all of the stakeholders, whether it was airports, the airlines themselves, mayors or provincial representatives. We are looking at the whole picture in terms of coming up with a series of measures. When we have landed on those measures we will, of course, make them public.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you, Minister.

Will you provide within your plan protection for consumers—those tens of thousands of Canadians who have not received refunds from the airline sector as a result of your inability to provide viability for the airline sector—by providing what I hope is finally viability for the airline sector? Can you make the commitment today, please, that you will also take care of these tens of thousands of Canadians who have spent tens of thousands of dollars, who have gone into debt and who have not received refunds? Will you ensure that these consumers are protected, Minister?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

As I have said, I am certainly aware of the fact that there are many consumers who would have preferred to have a refund as opposed to a voucher. They have expressed themselves very clearly on that. Again, as I said, we are looking at the whole picture in terms of the effects of this pandemic, not only on the air sector itself but also on the passengers who make use of that air sector.

Of course, as you well know, being a politician, I'm not at liberty to come out today in this committee and discuss all of the details of what we are going to do. I can only reassure you that we're looking at the whole picture at this time.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you, Minister.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

Thank you, Ms. Kusie.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

I believe I have 20 seconds left, Mr. Chair, according to—

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

No, actually, we're over by 25 seconds. I'm sorry.

Next we have Ms. Jaczek for six minutes.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

Pardon me, but do I not get six minutes?

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Did I have you at five minutes? I do apologize.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

That's okay, Mr. Chair. I appreciate that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Go ahead, Ms. Kusie.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you kindly, Mr. Chair.

Minister, I would also ask, kindly, that you tie to the plan, please, compensation restrictions for executives so that these funds will not go to executives, and please take care, Minister, of all regional routes. I am asking you on behalf of all regions of Canada to ensure that all regional routes are taken care of in Canada.

Thank you, Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Ms. Kusie.

Mr. Minister, do you have a short comment?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

I'll be very quick.

Again, thank you for your input, Ms. Kusie. We have very clearly said—in the Speech from the Throne, in fact—that regional routes are a priority for us. We actually highlighted it in the Speech from the Throne.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

Now we have Ms. Jaczek for six minutes.