Transport Committee on Nov. 5th, 2020

[Michael Keenan]

I would agree with the minister's characterization. We see ACAP as a really important program that helps those smaller airports meet the safety requirements. It's a heavily subscribed program. It's been at $38 million for a number of years, and we spend just about every penny. We may re-profile on that, but it's fully subscribed.

I would say that the ability of airports to finance safety issues—the safety investments and spending—given the downturn in the revenues is one of the many issues we're looking at and analyzing very carefully in the context of the economic crisis in the air sector.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Continuing on the situation facing regional airports, Mr. Keenan, I know that the minister alluded to the fact that there's going to be a plan that becomes evident over the next rise, and that we should hang on and wait for these details. I'm just wondering if you can speak to some of the strategies your department is considering in order to provide those smaller regional airports with the support needed to keep them viable, keep them financially sustainable and keep air transportation into the smaller communities through the pandemic.

Could you speak just in broad terms to the types of strategies that the department is considering?

[Michael Keenan]

What I can say on this is that we're working very hard and very diligently, analyzing all of the many stress points in the system, and we're consulting very closely with the operators in the system. We're doing it in such a way as to make sure we differentiate between the large airlines and the large airports, the small airlines and the small airports, and the remote regional communities that rely heavily, some of them exclusively, on the air mode as their link to the rest of the country.

We're making sure that the diversity in the system and the fact that there are extreme stresses playing out in different ways across the different parts of the system are fully understood.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

My last question is with regard to emissions and greenhouse gases from the transportation sector.

The minister was talking earlier about the different strategies to reduce those emissions. I note that in the departmental plan there are measurements provided for 2016 through 2018 that show that emissions from the transport sector have been stagnant. They've been roughly 7.5% over 2005 levels although your department has a goal to cut them by 30% of 2005 levels by 2030.

Are the strategies the department is employing to reduce emissions up to that task? Do we have effective enough strategies, and is there a plan to meet and exceed that 2030 target yet?

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Mr. Keenan, please give a quick answer.

[Michael Keenan]

That's a great question. Minister Garneau has said many times that transport accounts for one-quarter of all emissions, that it is the second-largest source of emissions in Canada, and he is working diligently with his colleagues at developing options and plans for additional actions to actually reduce emissions in the transport sector.

Mr. Chair, if you'll permit me, I feel I gave long answers and I left two questions from the previous member unanswered, which I could answer quickly if you could direct me to squeeze that in at some point.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Go ahead. Squeeze it in.

[Michael Keenan]

The first answer is that Transport Canada is working diligently on the application for the merger between Air Transat and Air Canada. The parties filed their latest undertakings with us a little over two weeks ago, and we're working through those. The department has received the motion from the committee for the production of papers related to the merger, and we're working diligently preparing to respond to that request, and we will ensure that we do so within the time allocated by the committee.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Keenan. Did that include Mr. Barsalou-Duval's question?

[Michael Keenan]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Great. Thank you, Mr. Keenan. I appreciate that.

We're now going to go on to the second round, which is going to start off with Mr. Soroka for five minutes.

Mr. Soroka, the floor is yours.

[Gerald Soroka, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Keenan, for appearing today.

As I reviewed the estimates, a few things struck me, particularly regarding some sums of money here in table 197. There was the sum going to the Asia-Pacific gateway and corridor transportation infrastructure fund. The stated purpose of this fund is to provide:

...funding for strategic infrastructure projects in British Columbia, Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba that enhance the competitiveness, efficiency and capacity of Canada's multimodal transport network focused on international commerce with the Asian-Pacific region.

I know you're aware of the Alberta-to-Alaska corridor. I'm just wondering if there has been any discussion within the department, and what kind of potential there is for this being put through.

[Michael Keenan]

Thank you for the question.

That item on the Asia-Pacific gateway and corridor fund is a re-profiling of some final monies under an infrastructure fund that started quite some time ago in budget 2006, under a previous government. The nature of infrastructure projects is that you allocate all the money, and the final payments tend to come sometimes years later on some of the larger projects. That project is really just finishing paying off on projects that were decided many years ago. There is no new intake under that project.

The national trade corridors fund, which was launched by Minister Garneau a little over two years ago, has moved quickly and has approved over 85 projects. I think we've put out about $1.8 billion, leveraging almost $4 billion in strategic infrastructure projects. That program is now fully subscribed.

There is a northern component that we've just opened up, and we're open to submissions on that. Essentially, if we get submissions for northern transportation projects, we assess them on a merit basis and go from there.

[Gerald Soroka, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

Okay. Once the project is submitted, then there's potential for this, or do you see any benefits of that Alberta-to-Alaska corridor being put through?

[Michael Keenan]

I'd actually have to check to see. I know what project you're speaking about, and because it's Alaska to Alberta, I'm not sure if it would qualify under the northern program or not. It would certainly qualify under the general program, but again, it would be subject to a proposal and a merit-based assessment. The challenge with the general program is that the government has fully allocated the initial funding on that program. There's a tiny amount left, and I know that the amount left would not be enough to build a railway.

[Gerald Soroka, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

I know it's not enough to build a railway. I'm just wondering about your viewpoint. If there were political will from the Americans and Canadians, is there a good potential for it to go forward, and would it save money in the long run?

[Michael Keenan]

It's difficult for us to opine on a project until we actually get a detailed submission and then assess it against the merit criteria.

[Gerald Soroka, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

For any of the northern projects, then, that's only anything within Canada, and that's only going to coastal waters, or how is that allocated, then? Is that air, ship and rail?

[Michael Keenan]

There's a $400-million dedicated northern program for those that are north of 60 projects, with a carve-out for Churchill, Manitoba. It kind of dips down north of 60 for Churchill. There's a geographic restriction to it. In principle, it's open to any project that improves transportation and trade gateways and reduces bottlenecks.

[Gerald Soroka, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

Now, again on table 197 under the estimates, a grant of half a million dollars is allocated to the “National Trade Corridors Fund” and, under the contributions, $450 million. You're saying that most of that money is already spent and is just being paid back now, or is there some new money for some other projects that I'm not aware of?

[Michael Keenan]

I think the monies you're referring to—and I'll invite my ADM of corporate services to correct me if I'm wrong—is what we call a re-profiling. It's in the supplementary estimates (B) because we shifted the allocation of money from one fiscal year to the next. There is a significant amount of money under the national trade corridors fund that's not yet spent, but we received a tremendous number of high-quality proposals.

We put them through a merit-based assessment criteria, and the government decided on and announced over 85 of them. Those 85 projects, we've committed the money to, and if the proponents do build them—and sometimes a project will go astray for any number of reasons—then we will have spent virtually the entire $1.8 billion. It continues to show up in our reference levels until we get the construction bills in and we pay them, but we don't actually have enough unencumbered funds to take on any major new projects at this time, unless the government were to decide to add financial resources to the program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Keenan.

Thank you, Mr. Soroka.

We'll now move on to Mr. Rogers for five minutes.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to Mr. Keenan and the other officials. Before I get to the questions, I want to go back in regard to Marine Atlantic.

I've also met with numerous people in the airline industry, CEOs of airports, people who own airlines and people who have a keen interest and a vested interest. One thing they keep telling me and saying about getting people back on the aircrafts is that we should have rapid testing. Rapid testing, they believe, will put people back on the aircraft and have them flying, particularly in the domestic market.

Mr. Keenan and other officials, thanks for being here today. I have a couple of questions around the impact of the current pandemic on service provided by Marine Atlantic, both the mandate of the constitutional one between Port aux Basques and North Sydney, and the non-mandated one between North Sydney and Argentia. Has the pandemic had any influence on the funding requested in the main and supplementary estimates that we see in front of us?

[Michael Keenan]

Yes, it has.

There's an item in the supplementary estimates for Marine Atlantic that has to do with costs and revenues. Is that not the case, Melanie? It's under supplementary estimates (B), and I'm trying to find the amount here. Do you have the amount there, Ryan, for Marine Atlantic?

[Ryan Pilgrim]

Yes, there's $2 million in the supplementary estimates (B). It's a re-profile of capital. Also, in supplementary estimates (A), $84.9 million was provided to Marine Atlantic for capital and additional operating dollars. Between the two, $86.9 million extra is provided to Marine Atlantic this year in the supplementary estimates, in addition to the $55.7 million provided in the main estimates.