Transport Committee on Feb. 15th, 2024

[Andrew Gibbons, Vice-President, External Affairs, WestJet Airlines Ltd.]

I'll just add to that, Mr. Bachrach.

After that incident, Todd and I reached out to the guest personally and had a conversation with her. Then we actually scheduled a discussion with the chief accessibility officer of Canada.

It's through those conversation that we're learning. That's how we're getting more information. We're not sitting around feeling sorry for ourselves and watching these clips on the media. We're taking action, we're meeting the guests and we're meeting with the chief accessibility officer.

As we've said, this is a continuous improvement and continuous learning exercise. There is a very strong culture of care in our organization—

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

I appreciate that.

What I would add is that when the committee hears things like the number of accessibility complaints is a very small fraction of the total number of people with disabilities that are transported, it sounds like—I'll just say it—you're minimizing the problem or trying to rationalize it, when what we want, I think, is proactive action.

I want to ask a question and I know my time is running out—

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

I'm sorry, but I just want to clarify.

I know it's a small number and we are proud it's a small number because it shows that our organization is taking this very serious, but nevertheless, I also said that every single case is one case too many. Every single case is a case that we have to fix.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Yes, I heard that as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you, Mr. Bachrach.

We'll go to our second round now. We will begin with Mr. Muys.

You have six minutes, please.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to our witnesses from WestJet.

We've had some discussion. You've talked about the fact that your procedures are being updated and obviously training has been in place for some time, which has been asked about already.

I want to ask not just about the training, but about the training that is done in terms of awareness and sensitivity. We're hearing some examples where staff walked by people who were having instances.

Has that changed given the media stories, some of which were highlighted here? How is that going to continue to change to make sure that...?

It's one thing to phone passengers and have that conversation after. What concrete actions are taking place to make sure there's a high level of sensitivity around these incidents?

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

First of all, we don't care about accessibility because of the media, but because it's a genuine part of our business to be an accessible airline. That's why we constantly improve.

Maybe I can hand it over to Todd to speak to some of the actions that he, as the leader of our task force, is now taking.

[Todd Peterson]

Certainly to your point, when we do accessibility training, a large element of the training is role specific, of course. What you'll train an airport agent to do versus a person who works in the cabin to do would clearly be job specific.

One thing that's common across all of our training is what we call the "sensitivity" element of training. We have a very strong portion of the curriculum focusing on respectful interaction, how to identify and work with guests to understand their actual needs, and then apply our processes and procedures in a way that meets their needs.

That is very consistent and uniform across our training programs.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

I want to ask about international airports, because we heard from the last panel, and we all know, that there are certainly standards around Canadian airports, but WestJet obviously flies to many sun destinations. You just mentioned one particular incident in Los Cabos.

What is your responsibility as an airline, in working with or understanding the fact that maybe the standards are different, the equipment is different and the procedures are different at international airports, to mitigate that proactively and address it upfront?

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

Of course, it's our job to ensure that we have consistent service across our entire network, not just the Canadian network. Having said that, we also have to work with the infrastructure and the way the airports that we fly to are equipped. Not every airport is the same. By the way that's also the case in Canada. If you go to some remote airports in northern Canada, it can also look pretty different from when you fly to Toronto or Calgary.

Whenever we are at an airport that doesn't have the same type of infrastructure, then we develop workaround processes that are safe and deliver the right outcome—although we recognize that sometimes they're not great, like in this example with the Paralympic athlete.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

We asked the last panel about the number of instances internationally versus domestically. There isn't good record-keeping or stats on that. I don't know if you could add some context on what you're seeing internationally versus domestically.

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

We would have to get back to you on that. I don't have the international versus domestic breakdown on that.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Do you track that? Would you be able to research that and table that with the committee?

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

Yes, absolutely.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

You mentioned, in a brief that was sent to the committee, and today here as well, that a fulsome review of your accessibility plan is being conducted. You were hoping to have meaningful improvements this year.

When you say “this year”, can you be more specific about a timeline? What are the key milestones that you would expect to see, that I think we would expect to see, to do this more expeditiously than just saying “this year”? There are 10 months left in the year.

[Alexis von Hoensbroech]

It's for as soon as possible, but I'll let Todd speak to that.

[Todd Peterson]

There are a number of items that are actively in motion. On some of the items, we're literally more like months away as opposed to “this year” away.

We would expect to be rolling out some of these solutions before summer. We're prioritizing them, especially the highest focus for us right now, the positive confirmation that the wheelchair boards with the guest. We have an existing process that we're going to apply to that. The materials and special tags that we need are already on order. As soon as they arrive, we'll be rolling that process out across our airports.

That is our highest priority, and the others will follow.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Muys.

Thank you, Mr. Peterson.

Next we go to Mr. Badawey.

Mr. Badawey, the floor is yours. You have five minutes, sir.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I'll start off by saying that I'm not going to repeat myself. With respect to the comments made earlier, you were in the gallery and you heard them, so I'll cut right to it and concentrate on the establishment of standards. When I say “the establishment of standards”, I'm saying end-to-end standards. I'm not just discussing this with you; I'm also discussing this with the folks who were prior to you, and, of course, the ones who are going to come after you. Of course, with that said, it's about harmonizing that end-to-end experience.

The second thing I'll say is the fact that it's also imperative that we recognize when we go into this process that the word “should” doesn't exist; it's “will”. Second, the word “no” doesn't exist; it's “how”. That is essentially the mindset, I guess, that we all have to have in reaching the outcomes that are expected by those who are your customers and, of course, customers of the airports.

The next thing I'll say—and again I want to emphasize this—is about this comment I made earlier on providing a positive customer experience end to end. Regardless of whether it's one person or a thousand people, it's relevant, it's important and it's a priority.

The last thing I'll say before I go to my question is the fact that it's all about service—service, service, service. With that, upon the outcome of this study and the recommendations we're going to be providing as well as the response that we're going to be expecting from the minister, it's still a work in progress to provide that end-to-end strategy. The expectation, as I said earlier, is that it's not the airlines, it's not just CATSA and it's not just the airports providing that strategy; it's end to end with airports, CATSA, airlines and others.

My question for you, Mr. Peterson, is—and it somewhat goes to Mr. Muys' question, but I want to get a bit more granular on where you're at now—is about your meeting with the Minister of Transport and the Minister of Diversity, Inclusion and Persons with Disabilities this past December, I believe. With that, both you and Air Canada have taken to the news, to the media, stating that you will be “investing significantly in new equipment at Canadian airports, such as lifts, to ensure that we can meet the expectations of our customers”—and, again, your customers are an airline as well as CATSA and the airports.

Can you provide us some details on the size and scope of this initiative and get granular on exactly what you've been doing from the time you had the meeting with the ministers until now?

[Todd Peterson]

As I was saying a moment ago, we have put a lot of effort into solving the large issue of confirming that the wheelchair is aboard with the guest. That is the first initiative we're going to roll out.

The second item we've been working on extensively is surveying our network and understanding the different pieces of equipment that exist across our network. As Alexis said, there is a variety, but we do need to get much clearer on our capability for handling mobility devices, specifically with respect to size and weight.

We think, through the work we've done so far, that we'll be able to confirm that in many cases we're able to handle devices that are larger or heavier than what we handle today. So there will be an increase in the service, but, as Alexis also said, in some cases we do need to be clearer with our guests about what our limitations are, and, in some cases, there will be some reductions. The good outcome on both ends of that is that our guests will clearly know what to expect from us.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Now, with that said, you are working with the airports and with CATSA to have that harmonization in standards and procedures, and then, secondly, the infrastructure that would be invested in. With that, are these investments based on airports or the number of accessibility services that you provide per airport?

[Todd Peterson]

We're looking network-wide for opportunities. As Alexis was saying, a large driver of our focus is where we've fallen down and had issues in the past. That highlights for us where the gaps are in our processes. We're not too concerned about exactly where they are. We simply want to find the most prevalent gaps and systematically close them so that we do provide that excellent customer service for all of our guests all of the time that you referred to.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Are you working with the disability community as well?

[Todd Peterson]

Absolutely. We have an internal task force. Of course, we're a large company and we do have people internally who have lived experience, and dealing with disabilities is part of their lives. We also work with outside organizations, such as the Open Doors Organization, to make sure that the community is heard, involved and understands what we're doing. We get their perspective to make sure that the solutions we roll out are suitable for their needs.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

I guess my final comment, Mr. Chair, if I may, is that this is going beyond the meetings we're going to have here, going beyond committee and the report and recommendations that we'll bring forward and looking beyond the response to the minister. It's continuing this process with the minister as well as the group we have here. Most importantly, it's the expectation about how you as an airline, CATSA as a service provider and the airports can make it an end-to-end positive experience for the customer.

It's going to be fluid. It's not going to end tomorrow. We're not going to have all the answers. It's going to be fluid. But let's look forward to that so that the customer does have that positive experience.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.