Transport Committee on Nov. 2nd, 2022

[Melanie Vanstone]

Transport Canada is taking a number of actions related to addressing labour shortages in the transportation sector. As I said, we're working very closely with our federal colleagues. We have been doing work to address regulatory barriers under our own department to ensure that they are not posing unnecessary barriers to entry into transportation careers, while also ensuring that safety and security are preserved.

Of course, we continue to engage closely to ensure that all federal programs in support of addressing labour shortages can be leveraged.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you.

My next question is for Mr. Brown.

Still referring to the report, it recommends supporting businesses, community agencies, settlement agencies, and other organizations that can help temporary foreign workers, like refugees and immigrants, acclimate to Canadian work and social environments.

What programs currently exist to support this type of work?

If there are none, how possible is it to put such programs in place?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Please give a short answer, Mr. Brown.

[Andrew Brown]

I will say that one of the things we work on in ESDC is programs such as the skills for success program, which funds projects to develop and deliver skills training and assessment resources to help Canadians—including permanent residents and refugees—to improve their foundational and transferrable skills. This is to help them prepare for and get ready to enter the job market. That's a way we start even earlier on to get people ready to enter the job market.

We're also looking at the sorts of wraparound supports that can be provided to workers. Again, this is to enable them to get into the workforce and, perhaps, subsequently further upskill and re-skill to move on to other jobs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Brown.

Thank you, Mr. Iacono.

Mr. Barsalou-Duval, the floor is yours. You have six minutes.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would first like to welcome you, Mr. Gionet and Mr. Gillespie. I am very pleased to see you here. I do not have the good fortune to sit on the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, but I hear about concerns relating to your work on a daily basis at my constituency office.

I can tell you that one of my staff works almost full-time handling immigration cases. I find that situation to be odd, since we work in an MP's office and not an immigration office. However, there are people calling us constantly, people who are crying and discouraged. Their cases have not been processed for years and they no longer know what to do. We try to help them, but we can't do immigration employees' job.

Do you acknowledge the problem you have on your hands, that cases are not being processed fast enough?

[Jean-Marc Gionet]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Chair.

We do acknowledge that there are backlogs. An action plan has been adopted to try to reduce the backlogs and get back to the service standards provided.

As we said earlier, a bundle of measures have been put in place, including recruiting new employees to support us in processing files. We anticipate that by the end of the fall, 1,250 new employees will have been hired to help us reduce the backlogs. We are seeing progress in processing applications for student permits, work permits, visas, and permanent residence. The backlogs are starting to shrink.

I think it is worth pointing out to committee members that since the beginning of the year, 552,000 work permits have been issued.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

When you say there are improvements in processing times, I think that is good news. I'm listening to you and I can't deny that it's positive. However, I would like a clarification. When you talk about average time, approximately how much time are you talking about? People are calling us because their file has been in that backlog for years.

What is the normal processing time for a file?

[Jean-Marc Gionet]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Chair.

It really depends on the type. I can provide the committee with statistics on processing times in the various categories.

For permanent residence, it depends on the immigration levels set, as the minister said earlier this week. We have to make sure that we process the files and that the number of applications is consistent with what we are capable of processing. However, for a program like work permits, there is no limit. We are preparing to process applications as we receive them. As I said, at the end of September, processing time for work permits was 116 days.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Could you tell us whether processing times for applications submitted in French are comparable to processing times for applications submitted in English? Are the figures the same?

[Jean-Marc Gionet]

I don't think I have that level of detail, but I can check whether data is available regarding the language in which the application is submitted.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

If you could provide us with that information, we would be very grateful.

You said you had a plan for reducing the backlogs. I am pleased to learn that and I would like to hear more about this subject. What is your plan for reducing the backlogs? We are talking about backlogs of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of files. When you have that many files, how do you proceed? I imagine it isn't done by magic.

[Jean-Marc Gionet]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Chair.

Once again, it is hard to give general answers, given the range of programs we offer. However, I will give you some examples. Mr. Gillespie talked about the post-graduation work permit program.

Very recently, using technological tools, we put in place a renewal, an extension of work permits to take into account the processing times for permanent residence. So we are trying to find new ways of processing cases by modifying the processes. However, we will not be able to do that for all applications. So it is important to make sure that we staff the positions with officers who are able to make decisions, to help us get back to the desired processing times.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you for your answer.

This time I will be addressing Mr. Brown, Mr. MacPhee and Mr. Hickey.

In addition to immigration cases, there are also all the businesses that contact us complaining about the processing times for temporary foreign workers. There seem to be blockages everywhere in the federal system. The temporary foreign workers come back every year, and it is difficult to understand why this problem has not been solved. The people have to come back every year to work in the fields. They are seasonal workers. However, there are also requests for temporary foreign workers in other industries. Still, the situation never improves, and even gets worse.

How is it that the situation is not improving?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Unfortunately, we will have to wait until the next round of questions for the answer, Mr. Barsalou-Duval.

Next we have Mr. Bachrach.

Mr. Bachrach, the floor is yours for six minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Brown, you mentioned that one of the areas that has potential for bringing people into the transport sector labour market is groups who are currently under-represented, including indigenous people. Now, there's a whole suite of different barriers that indigenous folks in northwest B.C. face to accessing the labour market, one of which is their lack of a driver's licence. There's a woman named Lucy Seger from All Nation Driving Academy who has done some excellent research on the barriers to driver licensing for indigenous people in British Columbia. A lot of the trends probably apply across Canada. I wonder if you're aware of this work and, if so, what you see as the role of the federal government in reducing barriers to driver licensing for indigenous entrants to the labour market.

[Andrew Brown]

One of the things you have touched upon there is the desire to get under-represented groups into the labour market, and here, specifically, we're thinking about into the transportation sector. Certainly, for us, indigenous people across the country would be one of those priority areas. We're looking at and already working with indigenous groups to improve our skills and employment training.

With respect to the specific study that you're referring to and the challenges with respect to obtaining driver's licences, I'm not aware of the specifics there. However, some of our programming is directed towards preparing people to get ready for the labour market, so there may be opportunities for work there. Certainly, through a number of programs we're continuing to bring and build in a focus on further inclusion—for indigenous groups as well as others represented in the labour market—and wraparound supports. This includes looking at the other things people may need to help them participate in the labour market.

There's ongoing work there, and certainly we would be interested in knowing more about the barriers that are being faced in indigenous communities.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Brown.

Perhaps we can have Ms. Seger table a brief with the committee that could be considered as part of this report, because I think it would be very relevant.

My next question is for Ms. Vanstone. You mentioned marine training. I was in Prince Rupert this past weekend. Prince Rupert has seen a real expansion of employment in the marine sector, largely due to the expansion of the port of Prince Rupert, but due to other activities surrounding that as well.

One thing I heard about from people in the community, from unions and from other groups, was the need for a local marine training facility. Currently, people who want to access these jobs have to travel all the way to the Lower Mainland for training at their own expense, which takes them away from their family and home.

I wonder whether your department has thought about the addition of regional marine training centres, and whether the B.C. north coast would be on the list as a candidate for one of those.

[Melanie Vanstone]

With respect to training, of course, it's important to understand that this is primarily a provincial jurisdiction. As part of the federal government, we work very closely, of course, and engage at various levels with the provinces around training.

From the perspective of Transport Canada, we are interested in engaging in more detailed conversations with our provincial counterparts to look at these kinds of questions, to ensure that we are doing what we can to have adequate training to meet the needs of the transportation sector. I think what has been raised here about the training being in particular areas is a very interesting question, and it is one that would be good for further conversation with our provincial and territorial counterparts.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Do I have more time, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Mr. Bachrach, you will be glad to hear you have one and a half minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

That's fabulous. Look at that—I'm getting more efficient. I think that's what's happening here. Efficiency, of course, allows us to be more productive.

My next question is around the temporary foreign worker program. Mr. Gillespie, you talked about how the government is working to expedite and provide express entry for foreign nationals employed as truck drivers.

This seems like a really positive move, certainly in line with what the NDP supports in terms of moving away from the temporary foreign worker program towards providing status for all foreign nationals who are working in our country and contributing to our economy.

Why would we limit it to the trucking sector? There are so many sectors of our economy that are in need of additional labour. What are the barriers to expanding this express entry to other sectors, either within transport or elsewhere throughout the economy?

[Dr. Ian Gillespie]

In this instance what's happening is that the national occupational classification system that we and ESDC rely on to administer both temporary worker programming and permanent resident programming is moving to the next iteration, the most updated iteration for it, NOC 2021. As it does this, the classifications are shifting. In particular, the truck driver occupation that I mentioned is shifting to be deemed a higher-skilled occupation.

The IRCC permanent residence programs governed under the express entry system aren't changing. It's simply that the occupations themselves are shifting around. The occupational classification system has over 500 occupations, and a number of others are being bumped up to become considered higher-skilled occupations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Gillespie and Mr. Bachrach.

Mr. Muys, the floor is yours for five minutes.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to all the witnesses for your time this afternoon.

I want to pick up on the questions from Dr. Lewis and Monsieur Barsalou-Duval with regard to the backlog.

We heard earlier in today's meeting from the national supply chain task force. One thing they talked about was the need for workers. They pointed to immigration and to temporary foreign workers as part of that solution. We also heard that from many witnesses throughout the course of this study.

You know, you can't confirm that there is a 2.6-million case backlog, and the processing time seems to vary, or it depends. There are lots of stats out there. I've heard 160 days and I've heard six months. What is the service standard in terms of processing applications at IRCC?