Evidence of meeting #9 for Veterans Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was laurion.
A recording is available from Parliament.
7:45 p.m.
Conservative
Fraser Tolmie Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK
I'm sorry, Chair. Did you say I had five minutes?
7:45 p.m.
Conservative
Fraser Tolmie Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK
Are you giving me two and a half from Mr. Desilets? I'll take them.
7:45 p.m.
Conservative
Fraser Tolmie Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK
Thank you so much.
There are a couple of things that I'd like to go over, so I'm grateful that I have the five minutes here.
When I was leaving the military, the pennies dropped [Technical difficulty—Editor] as two components of Veterans Affairs. One is post-career advice. We go through courses and people talk about the opportunities after the military, but the focus that we've mostly been talking about is health care. There is a health care component. The well-being of our veterans is both physically and emotionally, so it's health care in a different form.
This question goes to Ms. Lowther. I really appreciate your presentation. I am grateful for your service, as I am for everybody's service. Mr. Laurion, 37 years is a long time, so thank you very much for your dedication to our nation.
You spoke about having a checklist. In a previous presentation, we had a member from the LGBTQ+ community mention that when they went through the checklist, it didn't really work for them. I don't think we need to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but one of the things we really want to focus on is personalized care. How do we get to that? Yes, there has to be some form of checklist, but it has to ask the right questions.
Could you expand a bit on your comments and what you were sharing, so that I can bridge the gap?
7:50 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder, VETS Canada
You're right. A checklist sounds very impersonal, but case managers need some guidance in asking the right questions. As I mentioned earlier, a checklist could be done in consultation with veterans to make sure that the proper questions are asked.
We need consultation with veterans from all walks of life, so that we can ensure that the questions are asked pertain to each veteran's situation.
7:50 p.m.
Conservative
Fraser Tolmie Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK
Thank you very much. I appreciate that.
Another comment made earlier on by Mr. Laurion was about medical records being archived, as opposed to going to Veterans Affairs. I find that interesting. I'm wondering if there are some challenges, because of the confidentiality of medical records. They are not being entrusted to Veterans Affairs. Is that another area that we can expand on? Could you share your thoughts on that?
I'm sorry, Mr. Laurion. Did you hear my question? I asked if you could expand a bit on your thoughts on medical records being handed over to the veterans. I could see it being done immediately [Technical difficulty—Editor] or an issue when you're leaving, but some vets leave without any known issue and then it comes up.
Could you maybe expand a bit?
7:50 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
When people leave the armed forces, their medical records are of course transferred to the archives in Ottawa. In my case, Veterans Affairs Canada requested my medical records and had me fill out a document requesting that they be transferred to Ottawa. The next year I was asked to sign another document because the request had not yet been processed, and today I don't even know if they still have my records. I don't know what's going on, maybe they're understaffed, but it would be a great help to veterans if the processing of their file was improved and their individual needs were also addressed. They would be very grateful and it would remove some of the stress and anxiety.
7:50 p.m.
Conservative
7:50 p.m.
Liberal
March 29th, 2022 / 7:50 p.m.
Liberal
Wilson Miao Liberal Richmond Centre, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to all the guests today for this important study.
It's heartbreaking to hear that veterans are suicidal. I'd like to continue the line of questions asked by my colleague Ms. Montague. It's about the recent investment of $140 million to extend the staff addressing the backlog.
Can you comment on that?
7:55 p.m.
Director, Advocacy, National Association of Federal Retirees
The investment of $140 million is welcome, because the backlog does still exist and, clearly, additional resources are needed to deal with that. I would also note that two years ago we had a funding announcement in the order of $180 million or $190 million to deal with the backlog.
This investment does not necessarily link with better outcomes or better services provided to veterans. That would be the next logical place to go after understanding whether these investments are effective.
7:55 p.m.
Liberal
Wilson Miao Liberal Richmond Centre, BC
You mentioned in your opening remarks that francophone women have the longest wait times. You also emphasized that fair service should be provided to our veterans.
Can you identify the part where there is a lack of fairness during the process?
7:55 p.m.
Director, Advocacy, National Association of Federal Retirees
Regarding the lack of fairness, one of the metrics that we're looking at and that this committee is certainly looking at is in terms of the [Technical difficulty—Editor] when veterans make that first application or make an application to Veterans Affairs Canada. What kind of experience do they have following that? Is it comparable between groups when you control for sex and gender, language, and so on?
The simple fact is that it is not fair at that point. Using that metric, it's fair to say there is an objective lack of fairness. Fairness isn't only about the inputs, quantifying case files, the number of cases and claims that are made. Outcomes can also be uneven. What's not being measured in some of these processes is the impact that some of these services, programs, and even some of the delays themselves are having on veterans.
Some of it is disproportionate, based on the fact that some veterans wait longer than others, because of their sex, gender, language, or orientation, or any number of other factors that we've covered in our brief.
7:55 p.m.
Liberal
Wilson Miao Liberal Richmond Centre, BC
To follow-up that question, what more needs to be done to ensure equal treatment for all veterans, and also the under-represented veterans communities?
7:55 p.m.
Director, Advocacy, National Association of Federal Retirees
For federal retirees, it really boils down to three distinct areas. One of them is improved and more frequent and transparent reporting, including by having sex disaggregated and intersectional data on claims, the number of denied claims and the backlog by Veterans Affairs Canada.
We don't know what we don't measure, and there are some things we're just not measuring or that we we're not getting transparent data on. Again, that is something that committee members have commented on during the course of this study.
We're also noting the need for a systemic review to identify where and for whom the most significant barriers are to equitable treatment. The deputy veterans ombudsman mentioned that francophone women wait the longest. That's certainly an area with which to start.
Defined and accountable goals need to address those areas at Veterans Affairs. Our position is that the means to address those should include an objective of what a fair and equitable service delivery means to veterans, and to the department in the delivery of that service.
For us, it's also tailored support for women veterans. There are a number of things that we have mentioned in there that would support representation and the ability to get some scrutiny of the issues they are reporting and the places they are having difficulty.
Finally, we need to review the need for an office of equity within Veterans Affairs and how the department approaches that. We've mentioned some other pieces on reporting and connecting with stakeholders, and drawing better coordination between the Department of National Defence, the Canadian Armed Forces and Veterans Affairs in terms of research. Some of the investments that Prime Minister Trudeau suggested in the mandate letter for the defence minister would be helpful here.
Finally, it's making sure that decision-makers at VAC have access to the best available evidence to support those claims where inequities are happening.
8 p.m.
Liberal
8 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Before we go to the next round of questions, I have a quick question that I would like to ask Ms. Lowther.
It seemed that in your speech you said that for some case managers there are some high-profile veterans. Is that true? Can you explain a bit what “high-profile veterans” means?
8 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder, VETS Canada
There are some veterans who are very well-known in the veterans community and there are some veterans who are connected politically, I guess you could say. It has been our experience—we've witnessed it a couple of times—where veterans who fall into that category have received what would seem to be preferential treatment. For example, one veteran that I know of received the maximum of $10,000 from the veterans emergency fund with very little effort on their part, and was immediately approved for the income replacement benefit. We've only ever seen one other veteran receive that maximum amount. We don't know of any other veterans who received that treatment, so it does—
8 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you so much.
Mr. Desilets called and said the time is over.
Okay, thank you. I understand.
I now invite MP Anna Roberts, for five minutes. Please go ahead.
8 p.m.
Conservative
Anna Roberts Conservative King—Vaughan, ON
Thank you, Chair.
My questions are going to be directed to Debbie, but I want to read something before I direct my question.
I had an opportunity to go through your website. I have to tell you, it was very emotional. One of the stories I'll review with you is from a veteran.
This is his story:
This Veteran had been struggling and used his last bit of money to relocate to a new area where he had secured employment with Bombardier but just before he could fully get back on his feet, he was the victim of the Bombardier layoffs. He ended up living in his car. HOW WE HELPED This Veteran had reached out to “Helmets to Hardhats” who were unable to assist him but thankfully they referred him to VETS Canada. The Veteran was immediately moved from his car into temporary accommodations. We reached out to a company that we had partnered with who was interested in hiring Veterans with experience.... He was successful in getting the job and we assisted him in finding a new apartment close to his new job and paid his first month's rent and security deposit. THE OUTCOME
—and this is very important—
Twenty-five days from the day this Veteran reached out to us he was employed, housed and enjoyed his new job.
After reading these stories from the veterans, it did become very emotional for me, so I want to ask you something.
Your dedication of your company is absolutely amazing. Your organization has benefited many veterans. How can we build on your experience and the success of your foundation to ensure that we can learn and assist our veterans moving forward?
8 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder, VETS Canada
Thank you for the question and your kind words.
We're more than happy to share our experience with anybody who wants to learn from what we've learned, but I think one of the key reasons that we have such great success with the veterans we support is most of our volunteers are veterans themselves or still serving members, so there is that element of peer support that's certainly helpful. However, I think for us it's just connecting with the veterans and listening to their story and coming up with a plan, with them participating in the plan, to help them move forward.