Veterans Affairs Committee on Oct. 26th, 2026

[Andrée Paige, Co-Chair, City of Ottawa Veterans Task Force]

Good afternoon, Madam Chair and members of the committee. Thank you for inviting the City of Ottawa's veterans task force to contribute to this study.

I am the co-chair of the task force alongside co-founder Matt Luloff, and joining me today is Priya Bhaloo, our pillar lead for career transition. We are a volunteer-based municipal initiative. We connect people, organizations and resources supporting veterans and their families at the community level, but we advocate for veterans at every level.

Why have a municipal task force? While national policies, programs and funding are important, their value is ultimately measured by what happens in communities.

Veterans seek access to health care, housing and employment and they strive to develop a sense of belonging and inclusion within their communities. The gaps between different systems can become particularly apparent at the community level.

Today, I would like to discuss the difference between preparing a person to leave the Canadian Armed Forces and supporting them through their transition to civilian life.

First, I want to acknowledge the important work of the Canadian Armed Forces transition group and Veterans Affairs Canada. Through planning, through MTEP—military transition engagement and partnerships—through the national resource directory and through career services, Canada has developed valuable supports. The national veterans employment strategy also recognizes the importance of military skills and employer partnerships. We should build on these investments.

Here's something to reflect on. Release is an administrative event, but transition is a human experience. The two do not necessarily happen on the same timeline.

A member of the Canadian Armed Forces can attend information sessions, develop a transition plan and receive advice on benefits, services and employment opportunities. On paper, this person may be well prepared. However, what happens once they leave the forces? Responsibilities change, points of contact change and procedures change.

What veterans tell us is that the civilian world operates very differently, and navigating unfamiliar systems can become overwhelming: Go find your next opportunity. Go find an employer who recognizes your experience. Go find someone who can translate your military qualifications into civilian credentials.

For some, transitioning to civilian life can feel like literally falling off a cliff. It's not because resources don't exist but because knowing something exists is not the same as successfully connecting to it. Military personnel do not leave their skills behind when they leave the military. They bring leadership, technical expertise, operational experience and years of professional development. Some need additional education and credentials, but others are already job-ready. Those capabilities are not always understood or recognized in civilian employment. The question is not what else we need to create, but rather how we make what already exists work better.

CAF and Veterans Affairs Canada already provide guidance and connections to services, but how well do those connections hold as veterans move between systems, employers and communities? It comes down to needing more and better coordinated pathways to remove barriers, gaps and overlaps.

We can better support veterans, connect them with the right resources and strengthen the coordination between the provinces and communities.

Our responsibility is to ensure that the systems, programs and services in communities across Canada are ready to recognize them.

Priya will be sharing three practical recommendations to help make that happen.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

Now, for five minutes, we have Helmets to Hardhats....

I apologize. There was some time on the clock, and I believe that you were going to speak on the three aspects that you wanted to share.

I will give Ms. Bhaloo the floor. We have about one minute.

[Priya Bhaloo, Pillar Lead, Career Transition, City of Ottawa Veterans Task Force]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to the committee for having us here today. I'm going to go through the three recommendations very quickly. We can go over them again later.

Number one is education and training funds. Currently when veterans leave, they have access to funds that vary depending on how much service they've actually given. It can range anywhere from $50,000 up to $100,000. Only $6,000 of that is available for short-term training. Our recommendation is to change the way that funding is used and even make it available if a veteran wanted to start their own business or if they wanted to pursue different types of training or different assessments.

The second recommendation is continuity of security clearance. With the escalation of security and defence in the private sector right now, security clearance is a huge hurdle for veterans who are trying to find work. Those of you who may be familiar with this know that PSPC currently has a massive backlog of people waiting for security clearances. In order to work at DND, for example, you need to get a visitor clearance request. There are currently over 1,000 applications waiting. In the past, that process used to take a week. It currently takes an average of two to three months. We need ways for us to speed that up.

Last is an incentive for employers in either the form of a tax credit or a wage subsidy. If we can motivate employers to hire veterans and familiarize them on what that process looks like and what the various skill sets are, there is a huge value added for the actual community and it opens up a lot of doors for the veterans as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

Now, for five minutes, we have Mr. Cathcart.

[Darryl Cathcart, National Director, Training and Development, Helmets to Hardhats]

Chair and honourable members, thank you for the opportunity to appear before the standing committee today.

I represent Helmets to Hardhats, which was founded in 2012 through the visionary leadership of Mr. Joseph Maloney. It is now led by Mr. James Hogarth. We connect veterans, reservists, eligible family members and cadets to apprenticeships and employment in the unionized construction sector. My perspective on this problem draws on 26 years of regular force infantry service, as well as a doctorate in education, where I examined training, education and employment pathways for transitioning service members, reservists and military families.

Let's establish a common definition from our perspective today.

Prior learning assessment and recognition evaluates experience acquired outside formal education against established standards. It may result in academic credit or competency recognition but not necessarily occupational certification or employment. Helmets to Hardhats does not issue credentials. We work with unions, training centres and employers to see where military skills are recognized and where pathways may need some assistance.

Since our founding in 2012, 76% of our veteran and reservist referrals have been from army backgrounds. That is key. While not representative of all veterans, this aligns with VAC studies identifying former army soldiers, younger veterans and lower-ranking members as more likely to need employment and transition support. Moreover, the life after service studies series found that 47% of junior non-commissioned members had difficulty adjusting to civilian life compared with 21% of officers. A Canadian study of over 1,400 veterans also identified challenges associated with junior rank in army service. A 2026 VAC study reported that 28% had difficulty finding civilian work, with credential recognition being among the barriers indicated.

These findings do not prove that unrecognized learning causes transition difficulties. They do raise a policy question: Are recognition systems reaching those who need them the most? Consider a young infantry soldier skilled in leadership, instruction, logistics and risk management. Those competencies may not translate into academic credit, apprenticeship standing or employer requirements. Experience is undervalued when civilian systems cannot interpret it. Effective policy must connect three distinct systems: academic recognition, occupational certification and access to work. Progress in one area does not guarantee the next. We must measure employment outcomes, not credits alone.

I recommend that this committee call on the federal government to establish a nationally coordinated framework that documents military competencies in civilian language and connects them to education, apprenticeship and certification, along with employment pathways. The Canadian Armed Forces should lead competency documentation. Veterans Affairs Canada should integrate recognition into transition planning. Employment and Social Development Canada should align pathways with labour market demands. Employers must define competencies and translate recognition into employment opportunities. Provinces, territories, educational institutions, unions and regulators must shape implementation while retaining their credentialing and safety authorities.

No single organization has a monopoly on this issue. Pathways must respond to individual capabilities and regional labour market needs. This is an economic imperative. Housing, infrastructure, energy and defence projects need skilled workers. Veterans should not repeat demonstrated learning, but occupational standards must remain intact. Recognition systems must also adapt as industry evolves.

We heard in the previous session that Canada has invested in military talent. The opportunity is now to align government, education, organized labour and employers to ensure that talent is recognized, valued and connected to meaningful employment.

Thank you, and we welcome your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

We will now open our first round with Mr. Barrett for six minutes.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON]

Thanks very much, Madam Chair.

I want to first say thank you to you and colleagues for the statement that was issued by the committee last week following the tragic events at CFB Wainwright. This is my first time speaking at committee since then, and I wanted to just quickly and briefly acknowledge the lives lost from 3VP, Private Shaun Farrell, Private Aidan Goulding, Private Hayden Lykkemark and Sergeant Morgan Wong from the Loyal Eddies, with 39 other service members who were injured and 27 who are still in hospital, 13 in critical condition.

Like all members of the committee, I extend my deepest condolences to their families, their friends and fellow service members. Thoughts and prayers from members of Parliament and from Canadians are being offered up, and I take this as an opportunity to redouble my commitment, as I know all members of this committee and all members of Parliament do, to do right by those who are affected directly and indirectly during this tragic event. It certainly is a stark reminder of the importance of the work that we're called to do to honour the service that these men and women offer up for us every single day.

With that, I'll turn my question to Mr. Cathcart.

Could you tell me about the framework and expand on that a little bit? I've suggested previously that as early as at the recruitment stage—and I remember when I went into the recruiting centre and they had all the trades up on the board, and there were details about what I could do—there was a section that I know the recruiter kept kind of steering me towards, because that's what they were looking to fill, which was signals trades.

I think what would have been really helpful for me would have been to be able to see what jobs I could get if I left the forces. For example, the average member of the line trade leaves at the rank of master corporal or sergeant and finds employment in these areas with an average annual salary of x. That would be informative to the men and women who are seeking employment. I think that it requires a consciousness in the training that we're giving to our service members.

I also think there should be an imperative within the Canadian Forces to create an environment where people want to stay. Then they have the training, and they know that now they have their ticket. They have their journeyman qualifications and they have demonstrated leadership capabilities, but they stay because the environment is so good.

If they want to go.... In some cases they involuntarily need to leave, perhaps due to conditions that arise from their service or are caused by their service. That's what I imagine. Just to boil it down and update that pamphlet, if there are even pamphlets on the wall anymore—it's probably all online, on tablets or whatever—what does that look like? What does that framework look like for you?

[Darryl Cathcart]

These conversations often leave out an important partner, as we heard earlier in the previous session. Clearly, at Helmets to Hardhats, we're focused on the skilled trades, but that's a small percentage. We talked about the Nova Scotia Apprenticeship Agency and their peer organizations across the country.

What's missing from this equation are the employers. Schools—and when I say schools, I mean all post-secondary institutions—can grant credits for being a lineman, for being an infantry soldier or for being a stoker, as we heard, but if the employers aren't at the table providing their input, that is an essential gap. We're simply giving people credits for their military service. Whilst important, as Dr. Whelan mentioned in the previous session, that does not lead to meaningful employment outcomes, so we need to have the pathway not stop with that. Employers certainly need to become active participants in defining these competencies.

The other thing I would say that potentially addresses your question is that success must not be measured through employment outcomes or simply the number of credits that we gain through whatever framework. We need to ensure that sustainability is built into this process. We literally—the greater “we”—have been talking about this for decades. This is not a new problem. While some historical examples were indicated earlier, we can solve this problem. It's not insurmountable. We need to be really innovative and get some employers or employer representatives at the table.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON]

I have 30 seconds left.

Who should be putting together that table of employers across the skilled trades? Should this be driven by the private sector or organizations like yours, or should this be led by government?

[Darryl Cathcart]

Helmets to Hardhats certainly should be at the table, but this is a federal-level initiative that's led by VAC, CAF and, I would recommend, ESDC to bring in the important players.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON]

Thanks very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you.

Now I would like to invite Mr. Fanjoy for six minutes.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, witnesses, for this important discussion.

Ms. Paige, I'd like to begin with you. Since joining the City of Ottawa veterans task force, how has the military-to-civilian career transition evolved over time and what do you feel are the primary issues that we need to address to improve that transition?

[Andrée Paige]

To a large extent, we've seen terminology not be understood by employers. As that visibility and that understanding continue to increase and that awareness happens at the community level across Canada, that's been huge, but there's also been what I'll call a stereotype issue as well. It comes down to people who are maybe not familiar with the military having a perception that all veterans are broken.

There are a lot of injuries and there are a lot of issues around mental health that we need to take care of and to make sure that we're there for our veterans, but we have talked with certain employers who, without realizing it, were actually saying, “We can't give any priority hiring to veterans. We need them to apply for jobs like everyone else, but once they're in, we're going to accommodate them.” Well, what do you mean by “accommodate them”?

It's that perception that there is a lot of education that needs to be done to increase awareness of the skills, the leadership and the talent that come out of veterans and how to best support them, and I think the incentives come into play as well. If people don't have an incentive to prioritize veterans.... I'm not talking about organizations that have a mandate to hire veterans or a business priority to hire veterans—there are many of those—but there are no other incentives here in Canada, apart from a feel-good sort of perspective.

We need a lot more of that.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Yes, it's very interesting that you brought that up, and I sense that there is a cultural element to this. Even in civilian careers, people go through pivots. It could be a parent who's off work for a period of time and tries to re-enter the workforce. Women for a long time have talked about a glass ceiling, and perhaps there's a parallel here for veterans. Perhaps they face a camouflage ceiling where they are seen differently from other candidates.

I'm wondering how we break through that.

[Andrée Paige]

If you're not a veteran, usually you know a veteran. I think that's why municipalities need to get more involved and also be aware of what's happening at national and provincial levels.

We deal with far more than career transition. We also deal with health care, which is often considered a provincial issue. We also deal with housing issues, which are happening more and more at community levels, but how can we take the sources, the resources and not assume that they're going to magically trickle down to where they're needed?

We need community. We've heard it said that people want to talk to a person. They don't want to go onto a database and try to find things. They want to talk to someone who understands how to connect them to the services they need because sometimes they don't even know what they need yet.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Thank you.

I'd like to move to Helmets to Hardhats, and in particular, Mr. Giannou.

You weren't in our first hour of witnesses, so you missed the Nova Scotia theme. Welcome to committee. Although I represent an Ontario riding, I grew up in Nova Scotia, particularly in Halifax, so it's a big day for Nova Scotia at the ACVA committee.

What are the main barriers that you see preventing veterans from having their skills and experience recognized towards civilian apprenticeship programs?

[Dave Giannou, Director, Atlantic Region, Helmets to Hardhats]

Thank you, sir, for your question.

The biggest barriers I find are financial barriers. I joined in the 1980s. I served 36 years in the navy. When I joined, you could sign a contract for 20 years, at the end of which you got out with an immediate annuity. For me, I was 38 coming out with 40% of my pension. That money would allow me to transition into a new job and a new career if my old career didn't align. You heard earlier that 11 of our trades can challenge the Red Seal. That leaves close to 100 that can't. There's no civilian equivalency for those trades. You need to look at a different career path if that's what you want to do when you get out.

Now it's a 25-year contract. You're getting out in your mid-forties and looking at an option to move into a new career, if you want to stay that long and draw the pension. If you get out before then.... Most regular force members cannot draw EI when they release. They have no financial support. They have to move into something that pays the bills. They have families, mortgages and car payments to make. It's a big financial burden. The average corporal or sailor first class, once they have four years of service, earns $84,000 a year. The average new apprentice starts around $40,000 to $50,000 in Nova Scotia.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much, Mr. Giannou.

Now, for six minutes, we have Madame DeBellefeuille.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Vallée-du-Haut-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to thank the witnesses for joining us.

Mr. Cathcart, in 2023, a representative from your organization testified as part of a study. He said that, despite the efforts made, the results were rather lacklustre. The qualifications and experience gained during military service that enabled individuals to pass the Red Seal interprovincial equivalency tests didn't match the qualifications and experience gained in the construction sector.

Three years later, have you reached the same conclusion?

[Darryl Cathcart]

As stated in the opening remarks, it's important to desegregate who our clients are: lower-ranking army who do not come from a skilled trades background. Without commenting specifically on what was said in 2023, because it's not before me, what I can tell you is that we're not dealing with carpenters, plumbers or electricians in the military today coming out and becoming a civilian carpenter, plumber or electrician. We're dealing with people coming from the military with a combat arms background. A number of those military occupations come with skills that do not translate into a civilian equivalent.

That would be a response to that.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Vallée-du-Haut-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Cathcart.

Ms. Paige, I visited the Veterans Affairs Canada website. It stated that, in 2021, almost 23% of veterans were from Quebec. I don't know whether the proportion is the same today. However, so far, not enough emphasis has been placed on the importance of ensuring bilingual transition services that remain accessible to people in both languages. Think tanks, action groups and all the experts who come together should make it a priority to ensure that these transition services are always provided in both official languages.

Do you notice this concern coming up in all the business of the committees that you sit on? In your opinion, is this concern important?

[Andrée Paige]

Yes. It's really important to be able to speak in the language of your choice. Here in Canada, our communications are bilingual. People should have the choice to communicate in their preferred language, especially when they're working with the government.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Vallée-du-Haut-Saint-Laurent, QC]

In the task forces on which you serve and through your regular interactions with veterans, do you feel that this is a concern for National Defence and Veterans Affairs Canada?

Do you get the impression that this issue is considered important, or do people need to lobby a bit to keep it on the agenda and to make sure that the topic is discussed and recognized as a key part of military members' transition to civilian life?