Debates of Nov. 29th, 1994

Bosnia

[Jim Hart, Reform, Okanagan—Similkameen—Merritt, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the Bosnian Serbs have announced that they will shell the Canadian base at Visoko. Canadian personnel are

hunkered down in bunkers at this moment. The Sarajevo airport is closed. There is no humanitarian aid getting through.

Does the Prime Minister still insist that Canadian troops have a purpose in Bosnia?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, Canadian troops have played a very useful role there. When we look at the deployment of the Canadian soldiers to Bosnia, they have been called upon in very difficult circumstances to hold some very responsible posts.

They have been delivering food and medication and are still trying to mediate a possible peace. They are not there to make peace; they are there to supervise peace. There is no peace at the moment.

Yesterday I was very clear that everyone wants a ceasefire. We want the activities on both sides to stop so that Canadian troops, as part of the United Nations group, can play their role. I think they will serve to the end of their mandate because when Canadians say they will do something they stick to their word.

[Jim Hart, Reform, Okanagan—Similkameen—Merritt, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister wants something the Prime Minister cannot get because the situation has escalated. There is no humanitarian aid being conducted in Bosnia.

General Rose said this morning that the situation was beyond the capabilities of a peacekeeping mission. If the troops needed to control the situation were brought in, Canadian peacekeepers would be forced into a combat situation when they have no mandate to participate in war.

Is the Prime Minister suggesting that Canadians should go to war in Bosnia or is the Prime Minister suggesting that Canadian troops should come out? What is the Canadian government's position?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Canadian position is a very clear one. It is to stay there and try to bring about peace. This is why they have been able to help a lot in the last three years. There was a debate in the House of Commons. Everybody was consulted. The majority of the House wanted the Canadian group to stay there and fulfil its mandate.

We will be negotiating with our allies, but we have decided that the best course is to be with the others to try to install peace there. It is not Canada's role to engage in war. They are not there to make war; they are there to bring about peace.

Aids

[Michel Daviault, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Prime Minister, who will be leaving shortly for the Paris Summit on AIDS. Yesterday, the Prime Minister showed his complete ignorance of the subject. Unfortunate, but true. Let us hope he will be better informed today. The Prime Minister answered in the House yesterday that the amounts allocated for the fight against AIDS would be reviewed, as would all other government programs.

Will the Prime Minister confirm, as he is about to leave for Paris, that his government is preparing to cut funding for the fight against AIDS, contrary to the position he took when he was in the opposition?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I gave no indication that we intended to cut funding. We all know people would like to see us spend more on medical research, not just for AIDS but for other causes as well. The government has committed $203.5 million over a five-year period, and we intend to meet our commitments.

If we had more resources, we would be able to spend more. We still have $1.5 million which has not yet been allocated. The minister has several options, including the summit on this issue to be held in Vancouver in 1996. Part of the money will be used to prepare the summit, which will bring experts to Canada and help us make some progress in this area.

Yesterday, I was not aware of what was happening to the $1.5 million, but that does not mean I am not aware of what is happening in this area. In this particular instance, I did not know, I made inquiries and I have the answer today. I am sufficiently humble to realize I cannot know everything.

[Michel Daviault, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Mr. Speaker, this does not make things any clearer. The Prime Minister referred to a commitment over five years. If the government is unable to give a clear answer for this year, does that mean it has decided to cut funding for AIDS?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we have a budget that will be brought down in February. All items are now being reviewed. None are exempt, but there is no indication at this time that this particular item will be affected to a greater extent than other items. Personally, I hope funding will remain at the level we promised in the past.

Crtc

[Jan Brown, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Canadian Heritage.

On Friday the government announced its decision to override the CRTC by holding a review of our direct to home satellite policies. This review is being held in house and behind closed doors. Even though there will be public interventions in the

process, the decision will be made by a committee appointed by the minister.

The minister should prove that he is not trying to play favourites in the industry. Will he not allow the CRTC, his arm's length, independent organization, to give this issue its due consideration?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Canadian Heritage and myself today announced the panel that will be reviewing the submissions from the public in our reference under the Canada Gazette on the direct to home policy.

I want the hon. member to understand very clearly a couple of things. First, this is in no way an overruling or a setting aside of the CRTC decision with respect to the exemption order that was issued. That order stands and the CRTC has enunciated its views on how it would issue such orders in the future.

Let me also make clear this point. We are dealing with the articulation of government policy. That is the responsibility of the government and not of a regulatory body. That is what this party was elected to do last October. That is the responsibility we bear and that is the responsibility we will carry forward when this policy is announced.

[Jan Brown, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, is it indeed articulation of government policy that two of the three members of the government's so-called non-partisan committee have strong links to Power Corp, strong links to the Prime Minister and his associates or both?

The review process has not even begun and the fix is in. Will the Minister of Canadian Heritage restore the public's confidence in the process by dismissing the proposed committee and referring the matter to a joint heritage-industry subcommittee?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, the member has made a very strong statement concerning three people, all of whom are former deputy ministers in the Government of Canada who have demonstrated their good judgment, their integrity and their intelligence over many years.

I want to assure her that I have endeavoured to the best of my ability to determine whether there was any possible conflict of interest for any of these individuals. It is my view that there is no such conflict of interest. If the hon. member is aware of a conflict of interest, I would like her to make specific allegations as to the nature of that conflict and make them in a forum where she is accountable for those allegations.

In the meantime I suggest to her that it is improper to impugn the integrity of people who are operating on the basis of a request from the Government of Canada.

Fight Against Aids

[Réal Ménard, Bloc, Hochelaga—Maisonneuve, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

Yesterday, the Prime Minister did not know how Canadian programs regarding clinical research on AIDS worked. Yet, in 24 hours, he is supposed to discuss them in Paris.

Could the Prime Minister tell us whether his government has concurred with the joint proposal of the Canadian AIDS Society, the Canadian Hemophilia Society and the Canadian Public Health Association asking that the $1.1 million remaining in the discretionary fund be allocated to clinical and basic research to offset the acute lack of funds in this area?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I will try to explain the situation regarding this $1.5 million fund. I have said that part of it has already been allocated for the Vancouver Summit and that the minister will carry out her duty and allocate the remaining funds to areas where they can do the most.

[Réal Ménard, Bloc, Hochelaga—Maisonneuve, QC]

Mr. Speaker, how can the Prime Minister justify that a mere four months before the end of the fiscal year we still do not know the intended use of this discretionary $1.1 million? I remind the Prime Minister that last year $800,000 lapsed. They were not spent because the minister failed to allocate them to community organisations.

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, this kind of questioning is rather ridiculous. To allocate the $1.5 million we have set up a committee which has drafted guidelines for the selection of projects.

We are currently considering a few applications; they have yet to be approved. We have earmarked $400,000 for the Vancouver conference in 1996.

Child Support

[Beryl Gaffney, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Justice.

I applaud the minister's statement of last week that he would overhaul the laws governing child support in divorce cases. My question for the minister is how? How does he ensure the needs of children are met? How will his plans ensure fairness and equity between parents and, most important, when?

[Allan Rock, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, I have been working with colleagues in cabinet on the questions my hon. colleague has put this afternoon to prepare improvements to the legal system concerning the payment and taxation of child support.

I can tell my hon. colleague that the proposals on which we are working will deal with three matters: first, the method by which the amounts of child support are determined; second, the method by which they are taxed; and, third, the creation of a national strategy to enforce these orders once they are made.

In connection with the first and the third of them, we have also been working closely with provincial and territorial counterparts to ensure that the process is integrated.

The ministers of finance, human resources development, revenue and my colleague, the Secretary of State for the Status of Women, will be bringing forward specific proposals including, as necessary, changes to statutes when our preparations are complete.

Health

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the health minister wants to disrupt private clinics in Alberta that charge facility fees. This will disrupt private clinics in every province: chiropractors, physiotherapists, abortion clinics, executive health clinics. Shall I dispense?

Will the minister treat every private clinic in Canada in exactly the same way?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, it is very difficult when you are facing a bunch of clowns to be responsive.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

I know we all want to hear the response. I ask the hon. minister to please complete her answer.

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Sudbury, ON]

Mr. Speaker, private clinics charging facility fees for medically necessary services are a concern to all ministers of health across the country.

Last September when we met in Halifax, all ministers of health present, except Alberta's, agreed to work together to resolve this problem and regulate these clinics.

My message to Alberta is join the rest of us and help protect medicare, our finest social program.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, Alberta did not join this task force because she has her own task force and will report directly to the minister. She knows this.

Let me describe two clinics. One deals with cataracts; a facility fee of $1,275, a doctor's fee $526. Another clinic deals with fertility; facility fee, $2,750 and a doctor's fee of $1,235. One is in Calgary and the other one is in Toronto. If she shuts down the Calgary clinic will she shut down the one in Toronto?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, we know where the Reform Party stands on medicare now. For a party that prided itself on its integrity, it is a pity its members did not come clean during the election and tell the people of Canada they wanted user fees. They want cash register medicine. We do not. We want people to be treated because they need treatment, not because they have more cash than somebody else.