Debates of March 14th, 1996

Krever Commission

[David Dingwall, Liberal, Cape Breton—East Richmond, NS]

Mr. Speaker, if I have the unanimous consent of the House I would like to proceed.

The premise of the hon. member's questions is false, as it has been on several occasions in the House. The hon. member is fully aware of the reasons the Government of Canada is in court. It is not attempting to block his eminent justice in terms of his findings. What it is attempting, based on what the Attorney General of Canada has said, because he has an obligation, is procedural fairness and the rules of natural justice.

Furthermore, I do not think the hon. member opposite does himself, his party or indeed people across the country well by making such false allegations.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the minister's attempt to change the focus of the Krever inquiry by his own tainted blood forum he says is comprehensive. The hepatitis C group was not invited. The Janet Connors group was not invited. The Canadian AIDS Society was not invited. Who is invited? His buddies, his friends. What a farce. It is a blatant attempt to divert public attention away from the fact that the government is trying to silence the inquiry.

My question is very simple. Krever knows. Why not let Krever talk?

[David Dingwall, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, slippery language will not help the hon. member opposite in terms of trying to define his particular case.

The hon. member is fully aware and has known for quite some time that the Krever commission has made an interim report. Forty-three recommendations have been made, seven of which applied to Health Canada. We have acted on the substance as well as the spirit of those recommendations.

We announced earlier this week that we would attempt to commence a consultation process with the provinces and all of the stakeholders.

I am saddened to hear the hon. member opposite not only outside the House but on the floor of the House argue that we ought to be taking action. Now we are taking action but the hon. member is standing in his place trying to politicize a very serious issue.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, let us compare what happened in other jurisdictions.

In Japan there is a brand new health minister. Immediately there was a public apology to those people in Japan affected by its tainted blood scandal. In France those responsible are in jail.

What happens in Canada? We have legal wrangles. The government is not interested in the truth. The government is not holding those responsible accountable. The government is looking after its friends and subverting justice.

Japan and France have put the Liberal government to shame. Will the health minister advise his justice colleague to stop the legal wrangling and let Justice Krever speak?

[David Dingwall, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, three strikes and you are out. Once again the hon. member has falsified, has given misinformation as it relates to what is taking place. The hon. member knows fully what is taking place.

The Attorney General of Canada has stated repeatedly that he has an obligation to ensure that inquiry has procedural fairness and that the rules of natural justice be adhered to.

At no time has any member of this government, particularly the attorney general, the previous minister of health or I, ever indicated one iota that we are attempting to preclude or to prohibit Justice Krever from making his findings.

The hon. member knows the truth. I wish he would speak it once in a while.

Canada-Us Tax Treaty

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance. Yesterday, the Secretary of State for International Financial Institutions acknowledged that the new Canada-US tax treaty penalized Canadians and Quebecers receiving American pensions and that the Minister of Finance would discuss the matter with his American counterpart, Mr. Rubin.

With low income pensioners having seen their pensions shrink by 25 per cent, with no possibility of recovery, what sort of proposals, exactly, will the minister make to his American counterpart?

[Barry Campbell, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for his question.

The minister will be taking up the matter with his American counterpart. We are aware of the matter, the issue of concern and the number of Canadians affected by it. We will be discussing with our American counterparts appropriate solutions in the interests of those Canadians affected.

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the secretary of state gave us that answer yesterday. What we want to know is what the Minister of Finance will propose to resolve the problem.

Will the minister-or whoever can answer-agree to take the appropriate tax measures to compensate the tens of thousands of Quebecers and Canadians, should the Americans not respond favourably to his request?

[Barry Campbell, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, it is a matter we will negotiate with the Americans rather than with the member opposite.

I assure him on behalf of all Canadians that we will find solutions. The tax treaty was designed to prevent double taxation. We will address this problem. We will do it soon with our American counterparts.

Indian Affairs

[John Duncan, Reform, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the date of the three-party signing of the Nisga'a agreement now planned for March 22 was leaked while the province of B.C. was in the early stages of so-called public hearings.

Obviously the minister of Indian affairs knew of the date and yet said nothing, allowing the charade to carry on in British Columbia. These negotiations have been characterized by orchestrated, secretive manipulation of the public.

Why did the minister allow this charade to be perpetrated on the people of British Columbia while behind their backs he has kicked this exercise into overdrive?

[Bernard Patry, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the member for his question.

There is of course no secret in any of that. For the past 20 years, the Government of Canada has been negotiating with the Nisga'a people. If there are any secrets, I do not know where they are being kept.

There was in principle an agreement with the governments of Canada and the Nisga'a in British Columbia which they are ready to sign and which we hope will go through.

[John Duncan, Reform, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, people in British Columbia who were paid to know what was happening in those negotiations did not recognize one sentence or one paragraph in that agreement.

In response to my previous questions to the minister he has continued to perpetuate myths that there will be no constitutionally protected Nisga'a commercial fishery and that this deal would terminate taxation exemption for the Nisga'a. Also, the minister ignored my question on providing a role for the auditor general in this deal.

Will the minister care to come clean with the House on my questions and also tell us why there is hesitancy to allow the auditor general to monitor the spending of Canadian taxpayer funds on this deal?

[Bernard Patry, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, as to his supplementary, I will tell the hon. member that the public was consulted on 200 occasions-amply, I think-and now we must get on with things.

Government Buildings

[Gilbert Fillion, Bloc, Chicoutimi, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Public Works.

Tomorrow a tenders call will be issued to house the offices of Revenue Canada which are presently in Hull, on Sacré-Coeur street. Besides the building located in Quebec, four buildings on the Ontario side could meet the terms of the call for tender.

Could the minister explain why a tender call is being issued with regard to offices located in Hull, when it is usually not the case for offices located in Ottawa, as illustrated by the following examples: 191 Laurier street, where Revenue Canada is housed; 234 Laurier street, where National Defence is housed; and 340 Laurier street, where the office of the solicitor general is housed?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, we are trying to have an open and fair process. This is the way we will proceed and it is the way our government has been proceeding since it came into power. It is the only way to go.

[Gilbert Fillion, Bloc, Chicoutimi, QC]

Mr. Speaker, once again the government is applying double standards. It grants Ontario a contract for armoured personnel carriers, without asking for bids, whereas Quebec firms have to bid on the helicopter contract.

At a time when the government is asking its poorest citizens to make additional sacrifices to help reduce the deficit, how can the minister afford the expensive luxury of moving 800 civil servants, if it were not only because she intends to relocate them in Ontario?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, whether or not members opposite want to agree with us, the reality is that we are trying at every opportunity to get the best value for our dollars.

We have put in place a very open and transparent process allowing every region of the country equal access, allowing every business across the country equal access. The tenders go out and thereafter they are judged on the quality of the bid. That is the way it should be and that is the way it will continue to be.

China

[Lee Morrison, Reform, Swift Current—Maple Creek—Assiniboia, SK]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

With the world holding its breath while China flexes its muscles off the coast of Taiwan, it appears that China is buying some military technology from Canada. Would the minister mind telling us just how far he is willing to see Canada or Canadian companies go in their efforts to sell technology to China, including military technology?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, since 1993 the policy has been that ministerial approval would be on a case by case basis on any transfers or exports which were of a non-lethal, non-offensive kind.

Just to show how careful our examination has been, I can report to the hon. member that in 1994 the total sum of sales of any kind of military equipment, which I believe were suits to allow people to fight fires, was all of $10,000.

[Lee Morrison, Reform, Swift Current—Maple Creek—Assiniboia, SK]

Mr. Speaker, there is no such thing as non-offensive military technology. The submarine detection equipment that has been purchased by the Chinese from a Canadian company hardly qualifies as clothing.

There is a document marked "Canadian eyes only" which contains guidelines established by foreign affairs for expanding bilateral military relations with China. When were the most recent meetings between DND officials and representatives of the People's Liberation Army? Can the minister inform the House if the government is still interested in expanding its military relations with China at this time, given the current situation in the Middle East?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we might want to start with a little geography lesson first. The last I heard, China was in Asia. It may have moved in the last 24 hours while I was on an aeroplane, but I hope not.

[Lee Morrison, Reform, Swift Current—Maple Creek—Assiniboia, SK]

Just answer the question.

[Herb Grubel, Reform, Capilano—Howe Sound, BC]

There are no briefing notes on this.

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

If the Reform Party would like an answer, I would be more than happy to give a serious response. I will leave discussions of caucus politics up to members of the Reform Party. They are good at it these days.

If the hon. member had looked at the document which was released, it said that the purpose of the engagement was to develop relationships with the people's army in China and to begin discussing things like peacekeeping and regional security to provide a deterrent against the kinds of actions we are seeing today.

I can tell the hon. member that policy is constantly being reviewed. If we felt that those actions were leading to any kind of serious offensive threat, then we would certainly be reviewing our policy.

Tran Trieu Quan

[Suzanne Tremblay, Bloc, Rimouski—Témiscouata, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

Last February 4, a member of the press asked the minister designate, Mr. Pierre Pettigrew, if he planned to request the release of Tran Trieu Quan and he replied that he could not intercede with the Vietnamese government because he was not familiar with the case.

Can the Minister of Foreign Affairs tell us why, on February 9, exactly five days later, Mr. Pettigrew refused to meet the representatives of Mr. Tran's family and support group, who wanted to inform him of the situation?