Debates of Feb. 2nd, 1999

Health

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I said we also wanted the public to be clearly informed.

It is very important that the members of this House, who vote for the appropriations, know that the money is spent on health care and not used in other sectors.

I know that the provinces want to apply it, but we want a guarantee that the public will be kept informed and satisfied.

[Pierre Brien, Bloc, Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, what reason could the government have for not paying the money for health to a province if it has already agreed to honour the five conditions in the Canada Health Act and has undertaken to direct all the money it will receive to health care?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member has just added another factor, that of ensuring the five conditions.

We will be meeting on Thursday, and I hope that we will quickly reach an agreement so we may take the steps we want, which are not easy, because there are other government priorities. The premiers were all pleased to meet Thursday, and I am sure the meeting will be very productive.

Justice

[Jason Kenney, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we heard the attorney general say that she wants the rule of law. We want the rule of law.

Right now what we have in British Columbia is rule by judge and lawlessness when it comes to the possession of child pornography.

We want the rule of law. The constitution of this land says that this parliament has the power and in fact the responsibility to override irresponsible decisions by the courts.

Will this Minister of Justice give her members the right to vote their conscience this evening on this motion, yes or no?

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, as I have indicated, this government acted in relation to this matter and we acted quickly.

I do want to clarify something for the hon. member. If, for example, he suggests that the section in question, in Mr. Justice Shaw's judgment, is not in force in British Columbia or is binding on all judges in British Columbia, let me clarify that. In fact the judgment of Mr. Justice Shaw is not binding on—

[An hon. member]

Whip your people into line.

[The Speaker]

Order. The hon. Minister of Justice.

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Edmonton West, AB]

I simply want to clarify that Mr. Justice Shaw's judgment is binding only on provincial court judges in the province of British Columbia and is not binding upon any other judge, including Mr. Justice Shaw's reference to the B.C. Court of Queen's Bench.

I come back to the point. This government has acted and I would ask the official opposition to respect the rule of law.

[Jason Kenney, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, this Minister of Justice is not defending the rule of law. She is undermining it today by refusing to assert the sovereignty of this parliament to defend innocent children.

She says that this only matters to the lower court level in British Columbia. So only 10% of Canadian children are subject to this kind of obscenity through possession of child pornography.

My question is to the Prime Minister. Tonight will he or will he not allow a free vote so that his members can vote their conscience, yes or no? Will he allow a free vote, yes or no?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, this is a motion on which the opposition is trying to play politics with an extremely difficult problem. The members of my party do not want to use sensitive issues like this to play politics and they will not fall into the trap of the Reform Party.

Bell Canada

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, Bell Canada angered the public by deciding to sell off its telephone operators to an American company.

These 2,400 women are far from being guaranteed employment, and their working conditions are going to take a dramatic turn for the worse. The Telecommunications Act requires that quality services be provided and prohibits foreign ownership.

My question is for the Minister of Industry. Does the minister intend to intervene in this matter?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, under the Telecommunications Act, the CRTC is the body responsible for ensuring the quality of the telecommunications services provided to Canadians, including the services of telephone operators, in both official languages.

It is not necessary for me to intervene. The CRTC may intervene if necessary.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the legislation gives the Minister of Industry the power to issue directions, and he has already used that power against consumers in a CRTC decision that went in their favour.

Does he intend to use this power to issue directions to ask the CRTC to hold public hearings and this time serve consumers?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, it is always possible that the CRTC's decision will be appealed. If it is, I will have to make a recommendation to cabinet.

For now, I am not required to say anything before the CRTC has considered arguments and reached conclusions.

Aboriginal Affairs

[Mike Scott, Reform, Skeena, BC]

Mr. Speaker, 75 residents of the Musqueam reserve in Vancouver are facing financial ruin. Their life savings are going up in smoke. Many are retirees, in poor health, living on fixed incomes. They have asked the minister of Indian affairs to intervene on their behalf and to help them, and she has refused all requests to meet with them, saying that her obligation is to the band only.

If the minister of Indian affairs will not intervene to help these people, who over on that side will? Who has responsibility over on that side for the Musqueam residents?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, the question of the Musqueam first nation is a very complex one indeed. There is a contractual relationship between the first nation and the people living in the Musqueam park. There was a contract that was written in 1965 and the leases were to be reviewed 30 years later. This lease is legitimate. The first nation has a legitimate right to set the lease amounts. The federal court of appeal has actually said it is fair market value. That will be the process by which the lease will be signed.

In 30 years, indeed, the price of land has increased. It is very difficult for those people who are living in the park. As for my responsibility, I am glad to bring the parties—

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Skeena.

[Mike Scott, Reform, Skeena, BC]

Mr. Speaker, what the minister failed to tell the House was that those people signed leases with the minister of Indian affairs.

By doing nothing for the residents of Musqueam, are the Liberals saying that these people have no rights, that they have no future on the reserve and that they may as well pack up and leave their entire lives and their entire life savings behind them? Is that what this minister is saying to these people?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, what I will point out is that the first nation has a legitimate right, accepted by the court of appeal, to set the leases in this particular circumstance.

The role that I feel responsible to play is to do what I can to bring the parties together to find a mutually acceptable way to implement this legitimate right of the first nation.

Employment Insurance

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, what the Bloc Quebecois found out in its travels throughout all the regions of Quebec to meet with the victims of the employment insurance cuts is most serious.

Poverty is on the rise and the people feel abandoned by a minister who sticks to his role of technocrat.

Over and above his meaningless statements on the subject, does the minister not understand that the outcome of his employment insurance cuts has been the systematic impoverishment of the jobless and of the regions?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, as a government we have embarked upon an extremely important reform of employment insurance, and we have made a commitment to report once a year on the impact of that reform, because we are aware that it affects some regions and many individuals in this country.

I will have the privilege of tabling that report in this House within the next few weeks, and we will then, of course, be able to discuss the reality of this reform. It is not, however, as negative as the opposition would like us to believe.

International Conference On Population And Development

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval West, QC]

Mr. Speaker, between February 4 and 6, parliamentarians from the world over will be in the Netherlands to discuss the initiatives their governments have taken since 1994 to support the action program of the International Conference on Population and Development.

Could the Minister for International Cooperation explain to this House the measures our government and CIDA have taken to follow up on ICPD commitments?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister for International Cooperation and Minister responsible for Francophonie]

Mr. Speaker, CIDA has made women's health care one of its priorities. I must say that education is the program with the greatest effect on women's health, since educated women tend to have fewer children and healthier ones.

We are at the forefront in educating young women in developing countries.

National Defence

[Jim Hart, Reform, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

Mr. Speaker, today we have another example of obsolete equipment endangering the lives of Canadian armed forces personnel.

Canada's T-33 and Tutor jets have faulty ejection seats. These seats are so old and rickety that they are putting our pilots at risk.

Can the minister tell Canadians what is more valuable: replacing the ejection seats, or the lives of our pilots? Why not just buy new seats?

[Art Eggleton, Liberal, Minister of National Defence]

Mr. Speaker, of course the lives of our personnel are of utmost concern to the department and this government.

The seats are not the problem; it is the parachutes. We are putting new parachutes in the seats so that we can ensure the utmost safety of our pilots.