Debates of March 23rd, 1999

Bill C-54

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order please. The hon. member can put her question again.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, constitutional expert Jacques Frémont said this bill was a show of force.

Given the unanimity among Quebec's workers, business leaders and professionals, what is the Minister of Industry waiting for to return to the bargaining table with Quebec and the other provinces and come up with legislation that can be implemented without being challenged under the Constitution?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, we did work with the other provinces. After all, there was already a directive from the European Union that concerned us.

I think it is important that, in striving to be a leader in electronic commerce, Canada show it is capable of protecting the interests of individuals with respect to privacy.

We tried to work with Quebec officials, but our own officials waited in vain for six months and never got a reply from them.

Building Contracts

[Dick Harris, Reform, Prince George—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister's spin doctors claim that the Prime Minister did not know that Pierre Thibault was under criminal investigation for embezzling money when he got a wad of government cash.

Now that we all know that Thibault has admitted to misappropriating funds, will the Prime Minister demand that Mr. Thibault do the right thing and give the government money back?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, in that particular case, we went through exactly the same process. It is the transitional jobs fund, which has been supported by the mayor of Shawinigan. It has been supported by the provincial government in Quebec, by the provincial member of the National Assembly there. This particular project has created 59 jobs, 20 more jobs than had been forecasted at the time the project was approved.

Only these people here like to see big problems and try to make innuendoes that are out of place in this House.

[Dick Harris, Reform, Prince George—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to go back to the Prime Minister.

Mr. Duhaime bought a money losing hotel from the Prime Minister. Subsequently he received a grant from the federal government for about $1 million. We want to know whether Mr. Duhaime owed the Prime Minister any money on that hotel sale when he got the $1 million of taxpayers' money in the federal grant. Yes or no?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I have not been the owner of the shares since October 1993. I sold them to a person who was not Mr. Duhaime. I had no business relations at all with Mr. Duhaime. My shares were not sold to him. They were sold to another person who has not paid us as yet, apparently. It is in the hands of a trustee. I put all my assets in a blind trust. It is up to the trustee to decide how the money will come back, if ever I am paid, but not by Mr. Duhaime, by the one who owes me money.

Canadian Embassy In Berlin

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Foreign Affairs rejected, quite surprisingly, the recommendation of a committee of experts, almost unanimous in its choice of an embassy proposal, claiming there were other considerations beside that of design. There were, according to him, security, cost and development considerations. Mention should perhaps also have been made of the Winnipeg connection.

How can the minister say that there were other criteria not considered, that the group worked on design only, when his own ambassador and one of his senior officials sat on the committee to consider the very—

[The Speaker]

The hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs.

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

It is easy, Mr. Speaker, because he was not. The fact of the matter is there were four separate committees, one on design, one on cost, one on functionality and one on technical questions. Each of those four procedures came up with an independent evaluation of what would be the most appropriate choice. After those four reports were merged, the recommendation came forward and the choice was made. Nothing was overturned. It was based upon four separate criteria. I am glad to say a very distinguished Quebec firm was one of the winners.

Grain Industry

[Sophia Leung, Liberal, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the official opposition party has been blocking the back to work legislation for PSAC workers. As a member from the west, I am extremely concerned about the negative impact of the delays in resolving the PSAC strike.

Could the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food tell us how those costly delays are affecting Canadian farmers and the Vancouver harbour?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, because of the delays and the unavailability to ship frequently on the west coast, our reputation as a reliable supplier is again in severe jeopardy. It may take months and even years to recoup that.

Unfortunately the losses that occur are picked up by the farmers. The Canadian Wheat Board has had to withdraw from wheat sales until into April because it cannot tell its customers that there is going to be reliability of delivery in the loading of ships.

I look forward to the support of the Reform Party and other opposition parties as we move forward to get these people back to work.

Building Contracts

[Jason Kenney, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are trying to get to the bottom of this very murky affair. We would appreciate some direct answers to some direct questions.

For instance does the Prime Minister know whether Mr. Duhaime owed him money for the sale of the hotel when the Prime Minister's office went to bat for him and secured this nearly $1 million federal loan? Does he know whether he was owed money by the person who got the loan, yes or no?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, no. The money is owed to me by a person who is not involved in that at all.

[Jason Kenney, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we know that the Prime Minister sold the hotel in part to Mr. Duhaime. Mr. Duhaime received a federal grant for nearly a million tax dollars. We know that the Prime Minister's office interfered in that process.

The question is, did the Prime Minister receive any financial benefit from Mr. Duhaime and did that happen at the time that the grant was received?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the shares were sold in 1993 to a different person. After that there was a debt owed to me. I asked my trustee to administer the debt for me and so far, so good. Apparently, according to what was said some months ago, I have not been paid, which is too bad. I guess I will have a collection for my breakfast tomorrow morning.

[Lorne Nystrom, NDP, Qu'Appelle, SK]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

We are not talking about a golf course. We are talking about a hotel. Mr. Duhaime is no ordinary constituent of the Prime Minister. He is a constituent who did a business deal with the Prime Minister of Canada. In light of that, can the Prime Minister confirm that Yvon Duhaime had completed his payments to the Prime Minister for the purchase of the Grand'Mère Inn, not the golf course but the Grand'Mère Inn, by the time he was awarded a total of $814,000 in federal grants and loans in 1997, and that not one penny of this public money found its way back to the Prime Minister or his partners?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hotel was owned by the company that owned the golf course. I sold the share of that company in 1993. After that I had nothing to do with either the golf course or the hotel. I had no shares. That was clear.

The debt that was owed to me by somebody else was in the hands of a blind trust. I have nothing to do with it. I have had no relationship with the hotel or the golf course since October 1993.

[Lorne Nystrom, NDP, Qu'Appelle, SK]

Mr. Speaker, the question is, did Mr. Duhaime owe the Prime Minister any money in 1997 at the time that he received some $814,000 in money from the federal government in terms of grants and loans? Did Mr. Duhaime owe any money to the Prime Minister's associates in 1997, yes or no? Surely the Prime Minister knows the answer to that question.

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, he does not owe me a cent. In 1993 I sold the shares of the company that owned the auberge. There was no relation after that. I have had no shares in this operation since 1993. I cannot be more clear than that. I have no shares, no interests. He owes me not a cent, not a dollar, not a loonie.

Transitional Jobs Fund

[Peter MacKay, Progressive Conservative, Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS]

Mr. Speaker, we have seen this type of shady behaviour before in the transitional—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order. The hon. member for Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough.

[Peter MacKay, Progressive Conservative, Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS]

Mr. Speaker, you will recall that Jacques Roy, an employee of the President of the Treasury Board, gave confidential information on transitional jobs fund applicants to convicted Liberal bagman Pierre Corbeil.

Now the Prime Minister's special representative, Denise Tremblay, made sure that the transitional jobs fund doled out big dollars to convicted criminal Yvon Duhaime. What assurances can the human resources minister give that Denise Tremblay or others have not disclosed jobs fund information to be used for illegal purposes? What safeguards are there?