House of Commons Hansard #393 of the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was justice.
Francis Drouin Liberal Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON
Mr. Speaker, I hope you find my tie acceptable.
I would like to ask my colleague through which door I came in. He may not have noticed, but I was in the left-hand corner of the room at the beginning of the reading of the motion, and I was seated when the Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons rose on a point of order. I was in the room when the motion was read out.
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mr. Speaker, we must respect the institution that is the Parliament of Canada.
The Minister of Tourism, Official Languages and La Francophonie did the honourable thing, and I thank her for her honesty.
I would encourage some of my colleagues to reconsider their votes, including the member for Pontiac, the member for Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, the member for Madawaska—Restigouche, and the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship.
Interim EstimatesGovernment Orders
The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota
Members will take turns. The first member mentioned was the member for Pontiac. However, since the member is not wearing a tie, he cannot defend himself.
I therefore call on the member for Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier.
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mr. Speaker, the second member I mentioned is the member for Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia.
Rémi Massé Liberal Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC
Mr. Speaker, I would like you to clarify one thing.
There was a lot of noise in the House, and I was not wearing my earpiece. After my colleague's remarks, did—
Interim EstimatesGovernment Orders
The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota
Order. My earpiece is not working very well. Usually I can use my speakers, but I cannot hear anything right now because there is too much noise. I am therefore asking for order so that I can hear what members are saying. The system is not perfect.
The hon. Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Innovation, Science and Economic Development.
Rémi Massé Liberal Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC
Mr. Speaker, that is unfortunate because I am hearing all sorts of accusations being made on the other side of the House. Before they continue to make accusations, I would like to ask you a question. In all honesty, I am here to tell the whole truth. I admit that I was not here the first time that you asked the question. Did you repeat the question following the remarks of the member for Winnipeg North? In all honesty, I could not hear because there was too much noise. I did not have my earpiece in. If you say that you did not repeat the question, then I will be happy to withdraw my vote because I was not here the first time you asked.
Interim EstimatesGovernment Orders
The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota
Members must be in the House and in their seat when the recorded division is called. We consulted with the Clerk about this, and that is what I was told.
The hon. member for Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mr. Speaker, unfortunately, I do not interpret the Standing Orders the same way, but I will continue. I invite the member for Madawaska—Restigouche to explain himself.
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
Mr. Speaker, vote after vote, our colleagues opposite seem fixated on opposing measures meant to help Canadians and our communities. They are voting against funding for our veterans, for example, without reading the details. They were so fixated on making their point that they did not notice that I have been in my seat since 3:08 p.m., to be precise. I have not moved. I have voted at least twice, if not three times, since then. I invite the member for Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, who is looking at me, to go watch the video.
William Amos Liberal Pontiac, QC
Mr. Speaker, very simply put, I have been here for the last hour and a half. Every vote previous will demonstrate that.
As the question was being put, I was in my chair, and subsequently, as there were points of order being made, I walked up to give a document to a staff person on the other side, without ever leaving the chamber. I have at all times been part of this debate and I heard the question quite well.
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mr. Speaker, I would like to reply to my colleague from Madawaska—Restigouche that it is not a fixation. As a parliamentarian, I simply want to ensure that all rules and laws are properly enforced, and that is what we are doing. I would ask my colleague to withdraw that word.
I now invite the Minister of Immigration to set the record straight.
Harjit S. Sajjan Liberal Vancouver South, BC
Mr. Speaker, for the record, I came in at the time when points of order were being made and people were saying they could not hear. I sat here and listened to that for some time, and then when the question was read, I was in my seat at that time.
Interim EstimatesGovernment Orders
The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota
Before I go to the next point of order, I am just going to deal with this. We have made a decision.
I am going to leave it up to the individuals who were not here if they want to identify themselves. It is up to their honour to stand at this point to take away their votes.
The hon. opposition House leader.
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Mr. Speaker, I appreciate what you are asking. It is important, considering what the Minister of National Defence just stated. He said he felt he was in here because he came in while points of order were going on. However, what you need to clarify, Mr. Speaker, is that the question had begun, which is the time when we would expect that the minister should have been in the chamber.
You need to clarify, Mr. Speaker, that your reading of the question began just moments prior to the parliamentary secretary to the government House leader rising and saying he could not hear you. That is the time period, those seconds.
That is the beginning of the question. If members were not in the House at that point, they need to rise. It is not whether they were present while points of order were going on. It is important that you clarify that, and then you can continue as you did.
Interim EstimatesGovernment Orders
The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota
I am about to answer and make a ruling.
The question was to clarify who has the right to vote and who had the right to vote. When I began the question the first time, members had to be in the chamber—not necessarily at their seats, but in the chamber. I will leave it to the individual members and their honour to identify themselves.
We will go on to the next question.
The hon. member for Miramichi—Grand Lake.
Pat Finnigan Liberal Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
Mr. Speaker, I came into the chamber because I was told there might be a vote. It was very noisy, and I could not tell whether the question had been asked. I still do not know, but I am willing to withdraw my vote. The question was then repeated, and I arrived at the same time as everyone else.
Rémi Massé Liberal Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC
Mr. Speaker, now that you have clarified the matter, I can say that I was not in the chamber when you began reading the question. I therefore withdraw my vote.
Peter Fonseca Liberal Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON
Mr. Speaker, I believe I had entered as you were getting into the question, and then we got into the points of order, so I will stand.
Mike Bossio Liberal Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON
Mr. Speaker, I was here when you read the question, but I was not here when you read it the first time.
Tracey Ramsey NDP Essex, ON
Mr. Speaker, I just want to clarify and I want to make sure that my colleagues fully understand my interpretation. I appreciate the opposition member's statement, and this is my interpretation.
I was not here for the first reading, which was was followed by the member for Winnipeg North's saying that he did not hear. I was not here for that reading. Therefore, I abstained from voting. I sat in my seat.
I want to be clear for members on the other side that if they were not here for that reading of the question, they were not eligible to vote.
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Mr. Speaker, I rise on the same point. I was in the lobby when you read the question the first time. I heard the skirmish and came in, but from what I understand you reread the question before the vote. I heard the question and voted. I think my vote should count. That being said, if you think it does not count because I was not here before the skirmish, then withdraw my vote. However, I heard the question, I exercised my right to vote and I think that is legitimate.
Mario Beaulieu Bloc La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC
Mr. Speaker, I arrived after the skirmish began. Since you read the question I thought I had the right to vote, but since you are saying that is not the case according to your understanding and that we needed to be present from the very start of the skirmish, I withdraw my vote.
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Mr. Speaker, I was here both times but I must admit that, as I said in my earlier intervention on the point of order, I did not hear the vote number and I did not hear you finish it, so I did not ever consider that it had been read or commenced, because I was unable to hear. That was the point of order that I raised during the escarmouche, as my hon. colleague has been referring to it.
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
Mr. Speaker, first, I want to thank you for clarifying that, for those who were not in the House to hear you get started the first time, their votes will not count, being those who entered the chamber.
I saw a number of members who came into this chamber after you started the first time, who have not stood up and done the honourable thing and identified themselves. We expect more, and Canadians expect more.
We have rules here. Just like our judiciary, in the House of Commons we expect members to follow order and follow the rules. We make sure we that have people who are following the rules, especially in their roles as members of Parliament, and that they adhere to them with respect and honour.
I have seen a number of members who have not stood up. I would like to give them another chance, another opportunity. Those members include some cabinet ministers, whom I thought I had respect for and who I thought would be honest and do the right thing. They have not done that. I am really disappointed.
Could you, Mr. Speaker, ask one more time for those members who were not in the chamber to do the right thing and identify themselves? We are going to see it on the tape. I hope you are going to reveal the tape so that we can see it. It could be done right here, or we can do it afterward. We can make sure all Canadians know that they did not want to tell the truth and that they did not want to come forward. We expect that.