House of Commons Hansard #64 of the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was c-4.

Topics

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This summary is computer-generated. Usually it’s accurate, but every now and then it’ll contain inaccuracies or total fabrications.

Criminal Code Second reading of Bill C-225. The bill seeks to amend the Criminal Code to address intimate partner violence, classifying intimate partner murder as first-degree and creating specific offences. It also proposes stricter bail conditions for repeat offenders and enhanced risk assessments. While supporters see it as a vital step to combat an "epidemic" of violence, some members raise concerns about potential unintended consequences for victims acting in self-defence and propose amendments. 8200 words, 1 hour.

Making Life More Affordable for Canadians Act Third reading of Bill C-4. The bill proposes measures to make life more affordable for Canadians. It includes lowering the lowest federal income tax bracket, eliminating GST on new homes for first-time homebuyers, and permanently removing the consumer carbon tax. Conservatives argue the measures are insufficient and criticize the industrial carbon tax's retention. The Bloc Québécois opposes it, citing negative impacts on vulnerable taxpayers and demanding compensation for Quebec's carbon tax contributions. Liberals emphasize the bill's direct tax relief and housing support, attributing some affordability challenges to global factors. 39900 words, 5 hours in 2 segments: 1 2.

Statements by Members

Question Period

The Conservatives condemn the Liberal government for escalating food insecurity and record food bank usage due to high taxes and inflation. They highlight job losses and declining housing affordability, exacerbated by the industrial carbon tax. The party also questions the government's commitment to pipeline projects and Indigenous consultations, while accusing the Prime Minister of using tax havens.
The Liberals highlight their support for Canadian families through initiatives like the Canada child benefit, school meal programs, and affordable housing investments. They address unjustified US tariffs affecting Canadian jobs, emphasize climate action with the Canada-Alberta energy agreement, and champion AI innovation. The party criticizes the Conservatives for opposing these crucial measures and advancing border security.
The Bloc condemns the Liberal-Alberta oil deal as a "climate betrayal," claiming it makes Canada a worse environmental offender. They accuse the government of scrapping 2030 targets and abandoning environmental policies, increasing oil production, and betraying Quebeckers' interests.
The NDP calls for a coordinated system for marine debris spills, funded by an ecosystem service fee to protect coasts.

Petitions

Admissibility of Committee Amendments to Bill C‑12 Luc Berthold argues that committee-adopted Conservative amendments to Bill C-12 are admissible, contending they are relevant to the bill's purpose despite a Liberal challenge based on the "parent act rule." 1200 words, 10 minutes.

Adjournment Debate - Border Security Jacob Mantle raises concerns about frequent CBSA system outages, disrupting trade and border operations, criticizing the CBSA's response to his inquiry. Jacques Ramsay acknowledges the issue with the new CARM software, stating the minister has requested an investigation and the government is investing in border security. 1100 words.

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Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

Conservative

Ellis Ross Conservative Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC

Mr. Speaker, that is basically what the Liberal government has been doing for the last how many years, since I have been watching, anyway, in terms of not really looking after the average Canadian and not looking after low-income Canadians. If we look at the budget, for example, there are not many residents in my riding who can afford a $100-million yacht or a $100-million jet. Those poor billionaires who are maybe looking at the market for a second jet are going to be happy about this, especially corporations like Brookfield.

This is just an elitist budget looking after elitists.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

5:55 p.m.

Conservative

Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora—Kiiwetinoong, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am happy I was able to catch the Speaker's eye and join the debate. I appreciate the warm reception from my colleagues here in the chamber. I hope that they have that same enthusiasm after they hear what I have to say. Of course, I appreciate the member for Skeena—Bulkley Valley for graciously sharing his time with me to take part in the debate. He is a great, valuable member of our team and a wonderful advocate for the people of northwest British Columbia.

Before I get into the substance of this piece of legislation, Bill C-4, I think it is important to look at this within the economic situation that we have after 10 years of the Liberal government. There is no question that we are in an affordability crisis. I hear from people all across northwestern Ontario that they are struggling to put food on their tables. They are struggling to fill their gas tanks to go to work or to travel for necessary medical appointments, often along the highways, which is the reality of living in rural northwest Ontario.

This is a crisis that people are feeling day to day. We see it in housing as well, as housing costs have doubled—

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

5:55 p.m.

Liberal

Steven MacKinnon Liberal Gatineau, QC

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order, with apologies to my hon. colleague and his speech.

I simply want to inform the House that I will be bringing forward a motion for the unanimous consent of the House to schedule a take-note debate on the auto sector for this Wednesday evening.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

5:55 p.m.

Conservative

Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora—Kiiwetinoong, ON

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to continue the debate.

I was talking about this affordability crisis we are facing right across Canada and specifically in my region of northwest Ontario. We are seeing a housing crisis along with that. People are struggling to afford rent or housing for first-time homebuyers. Those who have a home are also worried about being able to hold on to it, with rising interest rates and the rising costs associated with that.

For younger people, many of them have given up completely on that dream of home ownership. It used to be the case in Canada that if a person played by the rules, worked hard, did the right things and got a good education, they could expect to have an affordable life, an affordable home, a safe neighbourhood and a good job, and to be able to pay the bills. That is the promise that has been broken after 10 years of Liberal policies.

We see this affordability crisis manifest itself at the grocery store as well, with food inflation on the rise. Stats Canada is reporting a massive increase in food costs, with beef up about 17%, chicken up 6.2%, apples up over 4%, carrots up 11%, and infant formula up nearly 6%. It is no wonder, with these rising costs, that over two million Canadians are visiting food banks in a single month. Again, that is a large national number. We see that happening in small communities across northwestern Ontario as well. I have spoken to individuals at food banks right across the region.

Recently, I had a chance to visit the food bank in Kenora. Thankfully, it had just received a lot of donations ahead of the Christmas season, but it is continuing to see an increase in people needing to visit the food bank, even just a couple times, just to get by. Of course, other people are struggling on a more steady basis and needing to visit more frequently. However, that demand has just continued to increase each year under this Liberal government, with the government's industrial carbon tax adding to the cost of food, and the food packaging tax and the Liberal fuel standard adding 17¢ per litre of gas, not to mention that the Liberal government's inflationary spending is driving up the cost of living. All of these things are adding to that cost of food.

If members look further than just the cost and the affordability crisis, Canada has the worst employment rate in about 25 years, and youth unemployment is at a record high that we have not seen since 2010, outside of the COVID-19 pandemic. All of this paints a picture of the economic situation we are in and why the Liberals are bringing forward Bill C-4, intending to make life more affordable for Canadians.

I would like to go into a bit more detail about this bill and the government's overall economic policy in terms of where it misses the mark. I would like to comment as well that in the budget we see just more of the same policies: bureaucratic spending driving up the cost of living, more taxes, and all of the things that are the status quo after 10 years of Liberal government.

The Prime Minister promised that spending would go down; it has increased by $90 billion. He promised the deficit would be $62 billion; it is now $78 billion. He promised that investment would go up, yet his own budget shows that investment will decline in Canada. We already heard today that the Prime Minister said he should be judged by prices at the grocery stores, but we know they are skyrocketing.

By every single measure, every single standard the Prime Minister has set for himself, he is missing the mark. Again, these are not the standards or the measures that I myself or the Conservative Party laid out for him. These are the measures that he has asked Canadians to hold him to account on, and he is failing on each and every one of them. While the bill does bring in some tax cuts, what they result in is about $90 per month in savings for the average Canadian. With Liberal inflation and spending, those savings are going to be wiped out.

The government has added, as I mentioned, $90 billion in new spending. That is $5,000 more in spending for every Canadian family, to put it in perspective, driving up the cost of living on all Canadians and pushing our fiscal situation to the point where we are going to be paying more to service our debt than the federal government is spending on health care transfers to the provinces.

This bill also brings in a GST rebate for first-time homebuyers purchasing new homes, and I think that is a very important aspect. It is for the purchase of new homes. I do not want to say it is none, but it is next to none. Virtually no first-time homebuyers in northwestern Ontario are going to be buying new homes. The majority of homes in northwestern Ontario are about 30 years old, give or take, and those are the ones that first-time homebuyers and young Canadians are going to be able to afford. Perhaps this is a well-intentioned policy on the part of the Liberal government, but it is one that, in practice, will not be effective for the vast majority of people in my region.

The Liberals, although looking to move on removing the consumer carbon tax, are leaving in place the industrial carbon tax. In fact, they have actually tripled that tax, and that is just going to make everything even more expensive, especially when it comes to the cost of food. Whether it is fertilizer on the farm, fuel in the trucks to ship it or power in the grocery store, this industrial carbon tax is still going to be passed down to consumers, just not in the more obvious way of the consumer price. Canadians are still paying for this carbon tax, even under the new Prime Minister's plan.

That is where I think this bill misses the mark. The Liberals have tried to adopt some Conservative ideas, but they have not gone far enough to actually implement them in the right way. As I mentioned earlier with the price of food, food inflation in Canada is rising faster than in nearly every other G7 nation. According to Stats Canada, grocery prices have risen more than 20% since 2020. Again, that is just to paint the picture of where we are.

Bill C-4, although bringing forward some steps in the right direction, at least from a rhetoric standpoint with the Liberal government, is not doing anything, nor is the budget doing anything, to address the real drivers of inflation, which are Liberal overspending, overtaxation and over-regulation. Those are the things that Conservatives are going to keep fighting against, and we are going to continue to stand for a plan that truly makes life more affordable for Canadians right across this country.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, first of all, I do not believe the member's comment when he said that our grocery inflation rate is higher than all the other G7 countries. I do not believe that. I would appreciate it if he could provide the source he has drawn that conclusion from. Second, the member says it does not provide tax relief, but that is what Bill C-4 does. Bill C-4 provides direct tax relief for over 22 million Canadians. It also provides tax relief for first-time homebuyers through an exemption from the GST. It also, in law, deals with getting rid of the carbon tax.

How can the member say that it does not deal with the issue of taxation? Will the member not agree that given what the bill does, we should be passing it before Christmas?

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora—Kiiwetinoong, ON

Mr. Speaker, unfortunately, the member for Winnipeg North must not have been listening at all to any of the comments I was making.

In terms of the tax cuts being brought forward, it is going to be about $90 per month in savings for the average Canadian, but with Liberal inflation and Liberal spending, that is going to be completely wiped out. He mentions the GST relief for first-time homebuyers, but it is only if they are purchasing new homes, which is something that is very rare and pretty much non-existent across northwestern Ontario. That is something that is not going to be useful for people in my region.

The member talked about the carbon tax. Again, the Liberals are looking to take action on the consumer carbon tax, finally recognizing, after 10 years, what Canadians know all too well: the fact that it drives up the cost of living. However, they are leaving the industrial carbon tax in place, which is going to continue to drive up the cost of living for Canadians.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Bloc

Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC

Mr. Speaker, Bill C-4 is the story of a Prime Minister who runs in an election, promises everything but the kitchen sink, comes to sit in Parliament and then introduces a bill too quickly. The bill is poorly crafted and poorly thought out.

For example, for the tax cut where the first bracket is reduced by 1%, the government failed to consider all of the potential effects because it worked too quickly. Tax credits, particularly those for people with disabilities, are calculated in proportion to the first bracket rate. As a result, when the government lowered taxes, it also caused the most vulnerable members of society, particularly people with disabilities, to lose more with the tax cut than they gained from it.

I would like to know if my colleague agrees with me. When the government decides to make tax changes, including changes to personal income tax, should it not systematically submit a list of all those who are likely to see the amount of their tax credits change, so that we, as parliamentarians, can understand the real impact of these tax changes on all taxpayers, particularly the most vulnerable?

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora—Kiiwetinoong, ON

Mr. Speaker, I think the member from the Bloc Québécois raises some very interesting, very compelling points. In response to that, all I can truly say is that it speaks to the broader discussion that I laid out in my speech around the fact that these policies being brought forward in Bill C-4, however well-intentioned they may be, are largely missing the mark in terms of what Canadians are looking for and the relief that Canadians deserve and need to see when it comes to tax cuts and relief from this cost-of-living crisis that, after 10 years, the Liberals have caused.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

Jacob Mantle Conservative York—Durham, ON

Mr. Speaker, it seemed to me that the parliamentary secretary to the government House leader wanted some sort of pat on the back for some small, minuscule relief measures in Bill C-4, when at the same time and with the other hand, they are taking and stealing from the next generation with a generational debt binge.

I wonder if my hon. colleague from Kenora—Kiiwetinoong could give his comments on this apparent contradiction from the other side, where they sprinkle a few savings but then steal from the next generation.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora—Kiiwetinoong, ON

Mr. Speaker, that is definitely what young Canadians are facing. That dream of Canada's promise has been taken away after 10 years of the Liberal government driving up the cost of living and pushing the cost of housing to the point that young Canadians are giving up on their dreams of home ownership. The Liberals are just moving forward with the exact same policies, which is going to continue to put more of a burden on future generations.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:10 p.m.

Marc-Aurèle-Fortin Québec

Liberal

Carlos Leitão LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Industry

Mr. Speaker, it is now my turn to speak to Bill C-4. I want to mention that my colleagues across the way spoke of minuscule savings. While it may seem minuscule to them, in my riding, in Laval, every dollar counts. I will not presume to know what constitutes minuscule savings for someone in serious need.

I am going to talk a little about Bill C-4, but I also want to talk about my riding of Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, in Laval. I want to talk about what the bill means to my riding. I will talk a bit about Laval. If I have enough time, I would like to come back to the matter of rising food prices.

To begin, I will start with Bill C-4. The bill responds to our government's priority of building an economy that works for everyone and taking concrete steps to make life more affordable for Canadians. The bill follows up on three of the government's initial announcements: cutting taxes for nearly 22 million middle-class Canadians, eliminating the GST for first-time homebuyers on new homes worth up to $1 million, and eliminating consumer carbon pricing legislation. Those are the three main components of Bill C-4.

What does that mean in my riding, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, in Laval? I would like to say a few words about my riding and the Laval region. As many people know, this city north of Montreal has one of the fastest-growing populations in Quebec. I believe there are now 460,000 people living in Laval. In the part of Laval that I represent, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, there are a lot of young families, but there are also older people who live in the more traditional part of that riding, in the former village of Sainte-Rose. It is a vast area where there is still a lot of land and agriculture in a somewhat urban setting. It presents quite a challenge. There is still plenty of land that could be used for housing. This is being done intelligently and in a way that is aligned with our desire to preserve green spaces.

The population of Laval is younger than the average. During the election campaign in April, we heard a lot about housing issues. Indeed, it is a very serious problem. The city's ability to support some degree of densification in Laval is helping to keep housing prices at a relatively affordable level, but there is pressure on prices and on access to home ownership.

That is why Bill C-4 is very well received back home in Laval. The second component, the elimination of GST on the purchase of new homes, can represent a significant savings of $20,000 to $25,000 on the purchase of a new home. There are new homes being built in Laval. There has been steady construction in Laval. I am not talking about Quebec as a whole, but Laval, where construction is progressing at a very good pace.

Young families will certainly benefit from this GST reduction. This effort will help many young families achieve their dream of owning a house or an apartment. It will also increase urban density and therefore encourage construction.

The housing problem is really a supply problem. The cost of housing is so high mainly because supply has not kept pace with population growth, even though supply in Laval has increased much more quickly than elsewhere in Canada. Still, with these measures and those of the city, which is very supportive of real estate development, I think we will be able to provide affordable housing in our region.

Laval's economy is very diverse, but obviously manufacturing is very important to our region. It creates a lot of jobs, which are generally well paid. Fortunately for us in Laval, the manufacturing sector is very diverse. No single industry is more prominent than another; it is very diverse. There are truly cutting-edge industries, especially in the life sciences, for example. Consider Moderna's vaccine plant, which is located in Laval. There are all kinds of other SMEs in aerospace and other fields.

Everything related to the uncertainty surrounding trade with our American neighbours is of great concern to us in Laval. During the election campaign, citizens told us that it was absolutely essential for us to be able to stand on our own two feet and find a way to maintain our access to the U.S. market.

There is one thing that is often overlooked and should be considered, which is that 85% of Canadian manufacturing exports to the United States still enter the United States without paying taxes or customs duties if they comply with CUSMA.

Because the manufacturing sector in Laval is highly diversified, exports remain very strong, but this uncertainty plays a very important role in any new investment project. We are seeing a major slowdown. We will have to pay close attention to this, because the creation of new jobs is currently being affected by the fact that most companies are waiting to see what the rules of the game will be a little later with regard to trade with our neighbours in the United States.

It is really the housing market that sets Laval apart from the rest of the province. I think that, even across Canada, it is relatively unique, because there is a lot of activity. There is a lot of construction going on. Prices are still reasonably affordable. There is an effort to increase the city's density. One of the problems resulting from all this is the significant challenge related to transportation and public transit as the population grows. Access to subways and public transit is becoming an issue.

The budget therefore also includes measures to improve local infrastructure and transport infrastructure, which is certainly welcome.

When it comes to Bill C-4 and the tax cut, let me be clear. When we talk about reducing income taxes, the people who will benefit from a tax cut are those who pay taxes. Someone on a very low income who pays very little tax is obviously not going to benefit from a significant tax cut, since they do not pay much tax to begin with.

There are other social measures provided by the federal and provincial governments to meet the needs of people with very low incomes, such as old age security, the guaranteed income supplement and, for younger people, the Canada child benefit. There is a whole series of social programs that support people with lower incomes.

An income tax cut has a real and significant impact for the middle class. It is not minuscule. I mention that because, recently, we have talked a lot in the House about the cost of living and especially about the pressure on food prices, and with good reason. Food prices are very high, even though inflation, the annual increase in prices, is much more under control than it was a few years ago. Prices really started skyrocketing as of 2022 and have now reached problematic levels, which is affecting a lot of families in Canada.

However, it is also important to note that, if the federal government started to massively reduce its programs to assist families, whether it be the Canada child benefit, old age security, the guaranteed income supplement or the national school food program, like our Conservative colleagues are implicitly suggesting, that would make life even more difficult for low-income Canadians. It would take away a big part of their safety net.

Furthermore, these are primarily international issues. Canada is not the only country where food prices are high. This is happening in the United States, in Europe, and more or less everywhere. I would say that we are now facing a structural change. For a long time, in North America, in developed countries, in Europe, and in Japan, we saw a long decline in food prices for all sorts of reasons, such as technological discoveries and new means of production. There was a structural decline in food prices shortly before the COVID-19 pandemic, but certainly after the pandemic, we saw this long-term trend change. We are now seeing upward pressure on food prices around the world, regardless of the Canadian government's fiscal and budgetary policies, which have no impact on the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or crops affected by climate change.

Our friends often cite the price of coffee as an example. Coffee is imported, but more importantly, harvests have been poor, especially in Brazil, but also, to a lesser extent, in Africa. There is less coffee on the world market. It is a question of supply and demand.

There is also a lot of talk about the price of meat. In North America, in the United States and Canada, structurally speaking, herds are smaller now than they were a few years ago. We have moved from a period of meat surplus to a period where herds are much smaller. This creates an imbalance between supply and demand. This puts upward pressure on the price of meat, sugar, cocoa and so on. All of these products, which are imported, are affected by climate change, and the supply of these products is decreasing.

It is not simply a matter of an industrial carbon tax. That is not it. In fact, every study completed shows that an industrial carbon tax has very little impact on consumer prices. While that may not be the case 10 years from now, at the moment, the impact of the industrial carbon tax on food prices is virtually zero. It really is a matter of supply and demand. It truly is an international issue.

In fact, the situation points to a need for more collaboration and international co-operation. My Conservative colleagues also talk a lot about massive cuts to Canada's international aid. They believe that Canada should drastically slash its international development assistance. Right now would be the worst time to do that. If we think that we have food problems, in a rich country like Canada, imagine what it is like for countries with fewer resources than us that rely on international aid to feed their people. I fail to understand how, at this point in human history, we can consider cutting international aid to less fortunate countries. This is really not the time for that.

I see that my time is almost up. I have a lot more to say, but I think I will continue at the next opportunity.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:25 p.m.

Conservative

Jeremy Patzer Conservative Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK

Mr. Speaker, I just want to pick up on a thread one of my colleagues was talking about earlier, with regard to Bill C-4 and the rebate on new housing.

We know that most first-time homebuyers do not purchase newly built homes. There is a phrase, “starter home”, that usually means an older house, smaller in square footage but more cost-friendly to purchase. This is what first-time homebuyers are looking to purchase.

We wanted the tax removed for all people buying a newly built home, and the Liberals changed that. Why would they do that?

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:25 p.m.

Liberal

Carlos Leitão Liberal Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would simply like to say that it depends on many factors. The situation is not uniform across the country. As I said at the beginning of my speech, back home in Laval, it is quite the opposite. The new homes currently being built are affordable for middle-class families.

Bill C-4 Making Life More Affordable for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

6:30 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker Tom Kmiec

I must interrupt the parliamentary secretary, as it is now 6:30 p.m. He may use the remainder of his speaking time for questions and comments the next time this bill comes before the House.

A motion to adjourn the House under Standing Order 38 deemed to have been moved.

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:30 p.m.

Conservative

Jacob Mantle Conservative York—Durham, ON

Mr. Speaker, I rise again this evening to speak about the Canadian border.

Let me recap last week. On Monday, there was a CBSA outage at the border; on Tuesday, there was a CBSA outage at the border; on Wednesday, there was a CBSA outage at the border; on Thursday, there was a CBSA outage at the border. Let me remind everyone what that means. That means goods are not being cleared for import, goods are not being cleared for export, just-in-time deliveries are missed, food is not delivered, consumers are lost and customers are lost.

I asked the CBSA in a written question to tell me how many border outages have taken place over the last several years, because I wanted to get a sense of the scope of this issue that I have been hearing about. Here is the response: “The Canada Border Services Agency concluded that producing and validating a comprehensive response to this question would require a manual collection of information that is not possible in the time allotted”.

The CBSA had 45 days to do this. That response from the agency is simply unacceptable.

If it is true, how can the CBSA solve a problem that it cannot even identify or quantify? I will note that the response was signed by the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Public Safety. However, we know that response is not true. I will not presume the intention of the agency, but I can tell the House that the answer is not true. How do I know it is not true? It is because someone else did the work that the CBSA said was not possible. The Canadian International Freight Forwarders Association reports that as of November 27, there have been 117 system outages this year alone, 69 failures, 39 maintenance outages, five system changes and four holiday issues. In a letter to the Minister of Public Safety just last week, the association said, “Minister—this is simply unacceptable.” I agree. It is unacceptable.

My very simple question to the parliamentary secretary is this. What is causing the high frequency of outages, why are they continuing to happen and when will they end?

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:30 p.m.

La Prairie—Atateken Québec

Liberal

Jacques Ramsay LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Public Safety

Mr. Speaker, I would like to start by mentioning that the Canada Border Services Agency manages borders at 1,200 designated ports of entry. It works very hard. It enforces our laws and constitutes our first line of defence nationwide.

The CBSA is an impressive organization with 8,500 frontline employees who play a critical role every day in protecting our communities, stopping the flow of illegal goods and preventing inadmissible individuals from entering Canada and committing offences. We have a strong border. We continue to look for ways to make it even stronger.

The CBSA assessment and revenue management system, or CARM, which is what Mr. Mantle is referring to, is software—

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:30 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker Tom Kmiec

I would remind the hon. member that using a member's name, whether first name or last name, is not permitted. He is the member for York—Durham.

The hon. parliamentary secretary may continue with his answer.

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:30 p.m.

Liberal

Jacques Ramsay Liberal La Prairie—Atateken, QC

Mr. Speaker, I apologize. What the member for York—Durham was alluding to is CARM, a newer software from 2024. It is not unusual for there to be outages or bugs with new software.

Furthermore, the department is not happy about the high number of outages, and the minister has acknowledged that. This is nothing new. I am not revealing anything new here in the House today. The minister has requested an investigation into this matter and has asked the agency to share its findings with him. Based on these findings, we will take action and ensure that those responsible, if anyone is responsible, are held accountable.

That said, beyond this new software, the border plan is much broader than that. We have invested unprecedented amounts of money, specifically $1.3 billion to strengthen the border, with more staff, advanced AI technology, new drones, helicopters, canine units, and more effective coordination and information sharing between partners.

The government takes its responsibilities seriously. As proof, we have invested more than $350 million to help the CBSA strengthen its frontline workforce and equip its staff with the latest tools.

The border security legislation represents another major step forward in border security. It is clear, therefore, that there are two important responsibilities. The first is to facilitate trade, which is particularly important. The other, of course, is to ensure our security at the border, stem the flow of drugs, and improve the integrity of our immigration system. That is what the president of the Canada Border Services Agency is doing. She is taking responsibility and communicating with us.

This is a team effort that we are currently undertaking. We hope to be able to rectify the situation that the member for York—Durham was alluding to. We are aware of it, we recognize it, and we are determined to act quickly to ensure that the situation is corrected promptly.

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:35 p.m.

Conservative

Jacob Mantle Conservative York—Durham, ON

Mr. Speaker, we know who is responsible for this: It is the Minister of Public Safety. That is how our system works, with ministerial responsibility. Unfortunately, the parliamentary secretary is woefully misinformed.

It is not just CARM. That is one of many systems that the CBSA uses at the border, and many of them have experienced outages. Even if it were CARM, the CBSA has been working on CARM for a decade, so the parliamentary secretary cannot tell the House that this is a new software and that we are just having some bumps. We have known about this for a long time, and there are still problems. This is unacceptable.

To add insult to injury, the CBSA issued a bulletin on November 26 warning businesses that it expects additional strain and delays because of Christmas. Christmas comes every year. This is not new.

What is new is that these outages keep occurring. CIFFA, the freight forwarders association, has one simple request for the minister. They wrote to the minister and asked for a meeting.

Will the minister accept that request and meet with them?

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:35 p.m.

Liberal

Jacques Ramsay Liberal La Prairie—Atateken, QC

Mr. Speaker, just last week, I met with the people that the member for York—Durham alluded to. He is not telling us anything new today.

We are taking responsibility. We have acknowledged the situation. We are taking steps to identify any defects in these new software programs. We fully expect the situation to be rectified in the short term. We recognize the importance of having a border system in good working order. In fact, the system in question has proven its worth to date. Right now, certain things need to be fixed, and we are fixing them. That is our promise and our strongest wish.

Border SecurityAdjournment Proceedings

6:35 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker Tom Kmiec

The motion that the House do now adjourn is deemed to have been adopted. Accordingly, the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 10 a.m. pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).

(The House adjourned at 6:38 p.m.)