Canadian Heritage Committee on Nov. 20th, 2020

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Thank you very much.

Let me go to Chief Yakeleya to ask the same question. We sometimes smush in the two issues. The first issue is about whether there should be a statutory holiday or just another national day in our calendar. I note that the Truth and Reconciliation call to action refers to a statutory holiday. Does it make a difference to you?

[National Chief Norman Yakeleya]

Thank you very much for the question.

If there is a day, I'm not too sure it makes a difference. You are in a better position to know than I am.

I think that if there is a day, it should be a statutory day for me and the Assembly of First Nations to recognize it as a national day for the residential school survivors and families. We've come a long way, and something needs to be done for all Canadians to honour the families and the children in this period of their lives, to recognize that there is something set aside for them.

Thank you.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

I don't have much more time, but the second part of that call to action is in fact that we use that day as a day of commemoration.

If you have any thoughts about what you would want—you said it can be used to help combat racism—what would you want to see us do as part of that day?

[National Chief Norman Yakeleya]

I would like to see a day of commemoration—for all people, especially those who do not have a real understanding of the impacts of the residential schools—whereby former students, like me, could have an audience with you and talk to you about the real impact of what happened when I was taken away and put in a residential school, and about how, when I listen to my mother talk about September 30.... Hearing the plane come in, she cried, because her children were going to be taken away for a long time and it really bothered her.

We didn't really give any honour to our parents and how they felt. They sacrificed us, and we did also. We should have an education of the people, that this is what really happened to us, because we couldn't really talk about it and about how it impacted our feelings and how it hurt us.

We just want you to know that we have a story to tell. Sometimes people in your position need to hear our stories and to give us the space and time. As the other gentleman said before you, we need an education period. I think the Assembly should work with you guys.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you, Ms. Dabrusin.

Now we are going to go to the Bloc.

I understand you are splitting your time.

We'll hear from Mr. Champoux for three minutes. After that, it will be Mrs. Desbiens for three minutes.

Go ahead, Mr. Champoux.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, that's what I was going to say, so you did the work for me and I thank you very much.

Chief Piétacho, thank you very much for being with us. It's always extremely touching to hear the stories of residential school survivors. Thank you for sharing these troubling stories with us. I think it's important that you are able to share these stories because that is how we can understand the horror that this has meant for generations of indigenous children.

There's a lot of talk about reconciliation. I have the impression that small steps are being taken, but they are always small steps. You talked earlier about the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples.

Do you think that would be the key? Would it be something that would solve a lot of things, or would it be something that would go a long way toward reconciliation with indigenous peoples?

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

This can be an important tool in the process. As I said earlier, I've accompanied elders from my community to the United Nations in New York and Geneva to work with all the First Nations of the world. In fact, Max Gros-Louis was part of these trips.

This would be a very important tool, since everything that should be applied and, above all, recognized is clearly stated in the declaration. Currently, it's a tool that can especially advance the fight against systemic racism. I can't stress this enough. Look, the residential school system is not just two or three priests. It's a system that was established. Let's also think about Indian reserves. We are living it. Again, it would be a very important tool, and I think it's unfortunate that its implementation has gone off track, for your own reasons.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Why do you think it's so delayed?

Why do you think the government hasn't decided to implement the declaration immediately?

What's your impression?

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

As I said, it's your system. You have elections every four years, you have bills that die on the order paper, as most of them do. We work very hard in our communities. We work at the grassroots. We're raising awareness among our people. For example, Bill C-92 is important for the protection of our children, and it's being challenged in Quebec, which is unfortunate. There are documents and tools that we should refer to, but they don't have the scope they should have. It's really a long-term job, which would deserve the consideration of Parliament.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you very much for being here today, Chief Piétacho.

I will turn the floor over to my colleague.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Thank you to you both. Your testimonies are very heartbreaking. I'm even struggling to find my voice to ask you questions.

We don't have much time, but I'd also like to thank you for marking the passing of Grand Chief Max Gros-Louis, whom I was fortunate enough to know. I'm a writer-composer-performer, and we met each other together on international stages. He was an absolutely exceptional man who left his mark on my memory. I offer you my most sincere condolences, as well as to the entire nation and to all First Nations.

At home, in Charlevoix, we have beautiful stories with our First Nations brothers. There is a project in Pointe-aux-Alouettes, in the municipality of Baie-Sainte-Catherine, that I'm actively working on with a Charlevoix-Est RCM committee. We would like to set up a commemorative site.

As part of the study of Bill C-5, which would establish a statutory holiday, I was wondering: if there were more memorial sites where we could celebrate and learn, if there were interpretation centres where we could provide information to the public, and if more sites were established across the nation, would this give us a chance to learn more about your history?

My daughter, who is next to me, tells me that she has had only one hour in all her high school years to discuss your history. It's not enough.

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

Absolutely. In the community where I come from, it took about 20 years before we could have the Maison de la culture innue. In fact, we now receive a lot of people. People from all over the world even arrived by boat before they were banned.

As you say, these would be quite significant places. They shouldn't be tourist places where people come to see and listen a little. We'll have to find another formula, which I'm already thinking about too.

If people really want to know our story, they need to sit down and listen to us, because we're not going to talk for just five minutes.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Nor should it be just one day out of 365. We should be able to access it 365 days a year.

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

Do you know the anthropologist Serge Bouchard?

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Yes.

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

He lived in my community and gave back to my community. It also takes people like him, who understand, who have lived with us and who give back to us.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

I take note of this, Mr. “He who comes with the wind”.

Do I have any time left, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

You have 30 seconds.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Chief Piétacho, what do you suggest regarding history classes in schools? How can we put pressure on our school systems and ministries to have more information and access to your history for young people?

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

It's going to be quite a challenge, because in Quebec, it's the curriculum versus our history. If people really want to know our history, it's going to take a lot of tact, understanding and decision making, and not just a little course like the one we know today. The important word to use is “meaningful”. It has to be meaningful.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Young people have a thirst for knowledge. My daughter is next to me and tells me she missed it.

Young people want to know your history. It's very important to take care of them.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you very much.

For the next question, we have Ms. McPherson for six minutes, please.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank both our honoured guests for being here and sharing their perspectives with us. This has been extremely interesting and extremely important.

I have a question for both of you, but the first question is for the chief of Ekuanitshit. I want to follow up on some of the comments you made regarding racism and the colonialism that impacts your communities and all of our communities across Canada.

We speak of Joyce Echaquan, who perished in a hospital in Quebec. We have a horrifying story of an Inuit woman in the Ottawa Hospital this week. There's Bill C-92 that you speak of, and in my province of Alberta, Bill 1 is deeply racist towards indigenous people.

One of the worries I have with a day for truth and reconciliation.... Of course I'm strongly supportive of it. It's something that my colleague Georgina Jolibois brought forward in the last Parliament. One of my worries is that we will use it as a way to sort of check a box. It needs to be a start. It needs to not be our efforts at reconciliation. It needs to be recognized as an important start, but a very beginning piece on how we deal with racism.

I'd love it if you could talk to me a little bit about those next steps that you think the government needs to take to deal with the systematic institutional racism in every province in this country.

[Chief Jean-Charles Piétacho]

Like most leaders, I don't feel political fatigue from preparing and presenting numerous briefs. In 1985, I served on the commission. I also participated in the Truth and Reconciliation Commission and the Viens commission in Quebec. We worked so hard, and we made every effort possible. As I was saying earlier, if all this isn't considered and if it's just a holiday where public servants have a day off, with all due respect, it's not meaningful.

Sometimes I think about the colonized that I am, and I become a colonizer. This concerns me as the head of a federal entity. The band council system was established by the federal government in 1876, and the federal government took over our land. As we say, colonization is the loss of everything.

We're lucky to still be able to go to our land, but there is a dispute. We can speak our language, practise our culture and bring our children inland, but for how long? That concerns me. There has to be change. When a federal government leader said he would change colonial policies and recognize our titles and rights, I thought, “Finally”! It took years. Then we were told that it would be put off for years.

There will be new elections, and we will have to start all over again. That's what tires me out. Every four or five years, everything we've done is trivialized or forgotten and put in storage in Ottawa. As the commissioner has already said, about 100 of the reports we have been asked for have been stored. Someone in Ottawa has become a millionaire because they've put all the reports we've been asked for into storage.

I don't know what it will take, but at some point it will have to be changed if there is to be true reconciliation. In Ottawa, on this report day, I met a young man, and we had a good contact. He wrote me a nice little note. It was already something.

For whatever reason, governments are doing nothing. There will be legislation, but all I hope is that it won't be used for other purposes.

Thank you very much to those who thought of establishing this day.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you very much.

I think sometimes I even see us going backwards, so I recognize your frustration and I want you to know that I feel it as well. It does feel as though these are things that need to happen.

My next question, I suppose, would be for our other guest. Knowing that reconciliation takes more than a single day and that we need to actually have a commitment and stop making the promises and doing the reports and the small pieces, and actually get the work done, what are the next steps for reconciliation that you see for the Canadian government to take on?

We know this is only one of the calls for reconciliation. Of the calls for reconciliation and of the calls for justice, what would you like to see us do next?