Evidence of meeting #7 for Declaration of Emergency in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was rcmp.
A video is available from Parliament.
Bloc
The Joint Chair Bloc Rhéal Fortin
I have a point of order, Madam Chair. I'm told that there's no longer interpretation.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
It may have been a switch. Can we check to see whether that is working on the French channel?
Bloc
Senator, Quebec (Mille Isles), C
I'll continue. Only 30 seconds had elapsed.
Ms. Lucki, I understand that you asked several companies to provide towing and that none agreed to do it. Is that right?
Commr Brenda Lucki
I'm actually not sure how many, because I was able to delegate the authority to compel tow trucks to the OPP commissioner.
Senator, Quebec (Mille Isles), C
You're familiar with section 129 of the Criminal Code, which states that anyone who “omits, without reasonable excuse, to assist a public officer or peace officer in the execution of his duty in arresting a person or in preserving the peace, after having reasonable notice that he is required to do so” is guilty of “an indictable offence and is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years”.
That is the provision of the Criminal Code on obstruction. You're familiar with it, right?
Senator, Quebec (Mille Isles), C
How many companies or heads of tow truck companies were charged with obstruction under section 129 of the Criminal Code?
Commr Brenda Lucki
I'm not familiar with anybody being charged under that section of the Criminal Code.
Senator, Quebec (Mille Isles), C
You had the authority to require that vehicles be towed under section 129 of the Criminal code and section 134.1 of the Ontario Highway Traffic Act. What more did the Emergencies Act give you? I understand that the order states that you have the authority to require that vehicles be towed, but you already had the authority to do that.
Commr Brenda Lucki
Under the Criminal Code, you can charge somebody. There were tow truck companies that were receiving funds through the protest not to assist us. Some of the individuals in the companies were very worried about their safety and their livelihood, and they were experiencing a lot of harassment. Even under a charge, it would go to court. Under the Emergencies Act, it compelled them to provide the service immediately. That was the sort of cover that they could use. They were no longer making the decision themselves. They were being forced under the authority of the Emergencies Act, and even then—
Senator, Quebec (Mille Isles), C
You could just as easily have forced them under the Criminal Code.
Commr Brenda Lucki
Well, we could force them with an ability to charge, and if they refused, then we would lay the charge and they would go to court.
Senator, Ontario, PSG
Commissioner, I'd like to follow up on your earlier testimony.
You informed us that, in your view, the events in Ottawa and elsewhere were not a failure of policing. If I'm correct, you also said that the plan you were developing around February 12 did not assume the emergency measures being invoked and that you had confidence in that plan.
In light of that testimony, could you comment on a statement made by the chief of the Ottawa Police Service, Peter Sloly, on February 2, during the events leading up to the declaration, where he was quoted in the media as saying that in his opinion, at least at that time, “There may not be a policing solution to this demonstration.”
Did the RCMP share that view?
Commr Brenda Lucki
It's hard for me to evaluate or pass judgment on Chief Sloly.
I will say that I believe there are always enforcement options. When you try to talk to people and they don't want to move in compliance without enforcement, you can always put together a safe enforcement plan, but you have to reduce the footprint in order to do that.
Senator, Ontario, PSG
At that time, Ottawa had invoked emergency measures, and it appeared not to be working, at least from public comments other than the police chief's.
Would you not agree?
Commr Brenda Lucki
Yes. I know they had police liaison teams that were trying to motivate people and convince people to leave the area, but I don't think it was working.