Evidence of meeting #46 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was witnesses.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Pat Martin NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
Did they ask you specifically to transfer it electronically instead of writing a cheque?
11:55 a.m.
As an Individual
Yes, that is what we were asked to do. Before making the transfer, I had to sign a document saying that I would return the money to the Fund.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Pat Martin NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
By wire? All right, I'll leave that.
Let me ask in more detail. I don't know if Mr. Caldwell has already specified this, but in regard to the advertising, were tags with your name on advertising that ran in your riding?
11:55 a.m.
As an Individual
Not the advertising of the media buy. I never saw a tag. I cannot affirm it, but I never saw a tag.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Pat Martin NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
So obviously your signage was part of the media buy, and your signage was obviously identified to you, but in the radio or the TV ads you don't remember seeing along the bottom, “This advertisement brought to you by Conservative candidate Caldwell”.
11:55 a.m.
As an Individual
No, the signage and the media buy were held distinct. On the signage, we were billed for that and returned the money, because we hadn't actually worked with the people who did the signs. That was about $4,000. The other $3,000 was identified as media buy, and in that money there was no tag that I'm aware of in the publicity that appeared.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Pat Martin NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
So you couldn't possibly say that was a local campaign expense if it didn't refer specifically to your local campaign.
11:55 a.m.
As an Individual
That's right, and I want to respond to that issue, because we do live in rule of law and there is a law governing these things. When the director of elections pointed it out to us, I think as an informed citizen I was able to make a decision with the law in front of me, and it became clear to me that it was not a legitimate local expense.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Pat Martin NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
Did you ever contact Elections Canada with that specific question?
11:55 a.m.
As an Individual
Yes. On April 27 we received a letter from Mr. Mayrand, dated April 23, in which he said the $33,000, not the $4,000 for the signage, was illegitimate since there wasn't adequate documentation—that is, a contract signed by us or a bill to us.
My agent and I discussed this, and we phoned the authorities, Elections Canada, who are the people designated by this Parliament to manage the elections. That was after the campaign.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
August 11th, 2008 / noon
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
Thank you. Mr. Chairman. I have a few questions for Mr. Goudie.
Mr. Goudie, I'm interested in a timeline with respect to when your campaign, either your campaign manager, I believe, who was Ms. Singleton, or your official agent, who I think was Mr. Hudson—
Noon
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
—I'm sorry, Mr. Barnes, your official agent—was contacted by Conservative headquarters to participate in what they're now calling a regional media buy. Do you know if that was in December?
Noon
As an Individual
No, it was not in December. It was actually during the campaign. According to the affidavit by Mr. Barnes, it states that on January 3, 2006, he received an e-mail from Mr. Hudson, which is attached hereto as exhibit A, and then apparently was recontacted on January 16 when the sum of $2,097.20 was deposited to our campaign account.
Noon
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
And you only became aware of this, as you have said to Mr. Tilson, when it became a public issue on CBC television in your province. Is that correct?
Noon
As an Individual
Yes. Perhaps I should take a moment, if I may, to explain that.
I mentioned earlier the size of the riding of Labrador and the number of communities. The only point I was trying to make was that communities are scattered, and during a winter campaign you travel either by vehicle, by aircraft, by snowmobile, or by walking. With 20 days in a campaign, I was doing a lot of walking, a lot of snowmobiling, and a lot of travel to try to get to all communities. So when this contact was made I was out on the hustings, if that term is acceptable, trying to drum up support for my campaign, to get votes, which is the objective of all of us who are in elected office. When I spoke to Mrs. Singleton about this matter following the news coverage in March and April of this year, she stated then, and repeated it in her affidavit, that she was following the direction of the national campaign. This was her first campaign as a campaign manager. Therefore, she didn't feel there was anything wrong if the national party was directing us. And because I was extremely busy trying to gather support for the campaign, it was not brought to my attention.
Noon
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
Mr. Goudie, in your affidavit I think you also said that you were angry that your campaign team had been dragged into this mess. I'm wondering if you could expand on that. Some of the comments, for example, that Mr. Sparrow, a Conservative spokesperson, made.... I think he said that it was sour grapes or because you lost that some time later you were looking to blame somebody.
You're a former Conservative minister in the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador. How did you react to a Conservative spokesperson saying that you're just trying to blame somebody? I believe Mr. Sparrow also said that it was ridiculous for you to say that you didn't know anything, because you signed the declaration. So he would seem to dispute the fact that you learned about when it became public on CBC.
How did you react to that?
Noon
As an Individual
Mr. Sparrow can declare whatever Mr. Sparrow wishes to declare. What I am telling you now, and what's in the sworn affidavit, which was forwarded to Elections Canada and is available to this honourable committee, is a statement of fact to the best of my knowledge. I do not recall anyone, including Mr. Sparrow, contacting me prior to this transfer of funds, during the transfer of funds, or following the transfer of funds. As I explained already, sir, my campaign manager, with a very busy campaign under way on her part and on my part and on everyone's part, did not feel that it was necessary, since the Conservative Party of Canada directed us to do this, to bring it to my attention.
Noon
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
That was presumably why you said you were angry that you were dragged into this mess.
Noon
As an Individual
Yes, precisely. I had had no contact.
The way the news report was carried in March and April of this year by CBC television left the impression, and the report itself left the impression, that there was something dreadfully wrong here with this “money in, money out” campaign, as they referred to it. I did not wish, as other witnesses have already stated here this morning, to be identified as a person who was doing something illegal or wrong or questionable or whatever. It was then that I went to a legal adviser and explained the situation as it existed, as I understood it. And that legal adviser advised me to do an affidavit, the sworn affidavit forwarded to Elections Canada.
12:05 p.m.
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
And drop a claim for reimbursement from Elections Canada for that amount.
12:05 p.m.
As an Individual
No. The only thing we have not been reimbursed for is the $21 transfer fee.
