Evidence of meeting #20 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was approach.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Gurbux Saini Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
I understand that some money was put to this in the last budget. Do you think it was enough, or do we need to do more?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
That's a little outside of my scope.
Looking at all the reports of the AI bubble and the amount of money being poured into U.S. AI companies, we would do very well not only to pour more money into some of our companies and our approaches in supporting them, but also to help them go global and to export our technology with rigour.
Liberal
Gurbux Saini Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
You mentioned Singapore or the U.K. as a model our country should follow. Can you give us the reason you picked them over those of the rest of the world that are advanced?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
The U.K.'s model, which has a principles-based approach and is sectoral-focused, does not take regulation off the table entirely, but uses an iterative approach to better understand where there are gaps in regulation and where it can better target regulation to support, if needed, a horizontal law. If not, it can support regulators in providing effective guidance through a consultative approach with industry and other players. I think that aligns very nicely with Canada's approach, generally.
Singapore is interesting. It has had a number of sandboxes, particularly AI Verify, which has been effective in testing different trust models. It has invested quite a bit in the national AI literacy program. We see a different reaction to AI in countries like Singapore that are more trusting of the technology, which will lead to greater adoption and a strong focus on economics and competitiveness.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Brassard
Thank you, Mr. Saini and Ms. Piovesan.
Mr. Thériault, you have the floor for five minutes.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Artificial intelligence is truly a monster in the making and it’s clear we can regulate it further. Earlier, we spoke about the former Bill C‑27, which died on the Order Paper when the election was called. The bill proposed the creation of the position of an artificial intelligence and data commissioner.
What do you think of that recommendation?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
I think that position can be very useful, depending on its mandate and, importantly, on how it is resourced.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
Artificial intelligence acts as a catalyst and a powerful accelerator of information control, and by extension, power. What is the best way to regulate this underlying motivation that guides developers?
The government, through its minister, has stated that it will put more emphasis on developing the economic advantages of the technology than on regulation.
What do you think of that approach? Shouldn’t equal emphasis be placed on regulating artificial intelligence and on promoting its economic advantages?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
I interpreted the minister's approach to AI, to my recollection, as being “light, tight and right”, which meant we would look to regulate, but in a tailored and focused manner. I think that aligns very well with the U.K. and Singapore approaches that I am proposing for Canada.
I was involved in the consultations related to the artificial intelligence and data act, and there were significant concerns about establishing a horizontal law that would apply in every context, but without sufficient consultation to determine if that was necessary.
I think the approach I'm proposing to this committee would allow us to balance the economic advantages with the controls that you speak about.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Brassard
I apologize again, Mr. Thériault, but we have another issue with the microphone. I’ll stop the clock as we look into it.
Carole, could you unplug and plug in your headset again, if you don't mind? It gets really tinny and hollow for some reason.
Can you give me another test?
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Brassard
I have to do this just for the sake of the interpreters. We don't want to cause any damage.
Mr. Thériault, you have two minutes and ten seconds left.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Ms. Piovesan, you have already explained that the regulation is intended to encourage organizations to change their culture, increase awareness, enhance digital literacy across the organization and adopt a more responsible approach to what they are building. You also said that it’s a matter of mitigating actual risks upfront. In your opinion, there is still some uncertainty with respect to some regulations, but if we put this into perspective, the same themes continue to emerge.
What are these themes?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
I think that's right. The focus for the business use of artificial intelligence is an analysis of opportunity and risk. That is one of the themes I've talked about.
We want our businesses to go forward and adopt AI, and we've seen that on a global scale. Canadian companies are still lagging a bit in adoption. We want them to start iterating, using this technology and becoming much more confident and comfortable with the use of this technology. We want this to be within a context of responsible use, meaning a risk-based approach to the use of AI within a context, ensuring that appropriate governance controls are in place where the use of the technology is hitting up against a higher risk scenario, to be guided ideally by the sector, potentially by government.
We've seen this before through the compendium document that came out with AIDA, but also through a sectoral approach to what risk looks like in a particular environment. Then there's the company's own risk-based approach and how it would defend the risk classification it has put forward.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
You spoke about balance earlier. Shouldn’t the government’s primary role in responsible innovation and design be to prioritize regulation, however light, to ensure it is upheld before pushing forward with economic development at full speed?
We want to increase efficiency, but as you said earlier, efficiencies can create other types of issues, including labour issues. All of this has not necessarily been assessed.
Managing Partner, INQ Law
Yes, but we need a targeted approach, which is why I am looking to the U.K. and Singapore as examples for establishing an appropriate targeted approach to what and how we regulate the use of AI.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Brassard
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Thériault.
You have the floor for five minutes, Mr. Hardy.
Conservative
Gabriel Hardy Conservative Montmorency—Charlevoix, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I have a question for you, Ms. Piovesan. If the minister had to focus on just one task and all his work over the next few years hinged on a single decision, what, in your view, should that decision be, to ensure the responsible and effective development of artificial intelligence over the next few years?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
It would be to augment the emphasis and mandate of the safety institute to make sure that it is properly established to lead and support the safe and responsible development and deployment of frontier AI.
Conservative
Gabriel Hardy Conservative Montmorency—Charlevoix, QC
For greater clarity, what would that safety look like to you? What should be the priority when it comes to safety in artificial intelligence? Saying we need to act safely is a fairly broad statement.
Does this mean making businesses more responsible so that they can be held accountable in case they develop destructive technologies?
Is a very rigid structure needed upstream to avoid crossing the line?
What does safety mean to you?
Managing Partner, INQ Law
Safety is in the standards that are put in place for developing the technology, how we evaluate that technology, how we clarify what the standards mean and how we establish ongoing monitoring in real time of the use of that technology. Then it is in how we coordinate and harmonize internationally to ensure that other jurisdictions are following suit. That's where I would place the emphasis.
Conservative
Gabriel Hardy Conservative Montmorency—Charlevoix, QC
Earlier, you said that Canada is a leader in this area and that it should sell its expertise to the rest of the world. In what way does Canada stand out, and is it a leader in artificial intelligence? In what ways do our practices influence the rest of the world?