Foreign Affairs Committee on Nov. 3rd, 2009

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Yes. What we're talking about are people intercepted in the foreign country before they were able to board a flight to Canada. In the vast majority of cases, I'd say in over 99% of cases, the authority would have been our own MIO.

I may even have gone too far, because the cases in which a decision would be made on whether an individual has the right to travel to Canada always comes down to a Canadian official making that call. What I was alluding to was that in certain cases--remember that I said we help one another logistically--if we're not able to get to the airport, one of our colleagues, such as a Dutch airline liaison officer, for example, might. He might make the initial interception, but as soon as possible it'll be turned over to a Canadian MIO. And it'll be the Canadian migration integrity officer who makes the decision.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

There used to be a problem of people getting on board a plane with proper documentation and then landing in Canada and their documentation had gone missing. Is that still prevalent?

The other issue is probably visas. Many countries need visas to come to this country. Are there still cases of people arriving in Canada without the documentation they got onto the plane with?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Yes, that still happens every day.

As I said, our success rate is 70%, but that means that 30% either are allowed to board a flight to Canada without proper documentation, despite our very best efforts, or they may even have been properly documented when they boarded the plane but destroyed the documentation en route.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

What happens to those people who arrive and don't have documentation?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

When they arrive, the very likely occurrence is that they'll claim refugee status and they'll be entered into the refugee system.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Of the 3,000 Canadians who've been facilitated and have returned to this country, what forms of documentation were you able to assist them with? What are the most prevalent ones?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

This will come down to a discussion with consular affairs locally. Let me talk about two different cases.

In one case, let's say someone wishing to travel to Canada has been intercepted by an airline employee or by a local official because the case doesn't look right to them. They call in the migration integrity officer. The migration integrity officer might do an interview over the phone or might come to the airport and do an interview, and in most cases the case is resolved to the satisfaction of the Canadian wishing to travel.

The other case could be where a Canadian shows up wishing to embark on a flight and discovers that he doesn't have the correct documentation. The documentation may have been lost or stolen. In those cases, again, the MIO will very often be called in, and the MIO will be able to refer that person to our consular colleagues, who may be able to issue an emergency passport or may be able to use their judgment to issue another document that will enable the Canadian to travel back to Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Thank you, Mr. Goldring.

Mr. Dewar.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Maybe another scenario would be that the person has been detained after there is a question about their documentation, and in that case the person is asking the government to provide support. If that support isn't given in a timely fashion.... Actually, this question is not for you, Mr. Leckey, unless you want to add something. It would be for the consular affairs people.

If the person was not able to get support from consular affairs officials in a timely fashion--we've established there's no legal statute that says that the consular affairs officials from the Government of Canada have to provide that support--how could they actually follow up with the government to make the case that they should have received support? In other words, is there any grievance mechanism for Canadians if they don't receive the support they believe they should have received if they've been stranded abroad?

Is there an appeal process for Canadians if they don't receive the support they thought they should have received, according to the act?

[Lillian Thomsen]

Well, there isn't an act.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I'm sorry. I'm talking about the act that you're under, which is the Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade Act. Section 10 is where you frame your--

[Lillian Thomsen]

The responsibility of the minister for the conduct of consular affairs.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

That's right, yes.

[Lillian Thomsen]

In response to your earlier question, as I said, there is no statute. Canadians who are unhappy with consular services can and do raise their concerns ex post facto. Some do it through their member of Parliament. Some do it by writing to the minister. Some do it by telephone. We do conduct client satisfaction surveys. We do these both on the web and at the point of service. The vast majority of these satisfaction surveys come back very high, but they are for routine services--in other words, did you get a passport within the timeline of service?

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I'm sorry to interrupt. So basically, in terms of the department, if someone has a grievance or concern, if they had problems or were denied services, there's not a built-in process, an internal mechanism that they could appeal to.

[Lillian Thomsen]

If they write to the minister, the letter will be forwarded to the consular services, and if we have to go back to a post to get clarification on how the Canadian was served at the post, we do so. We get an awful lot of correspondence and we do get concerns about service--not that many, but they are responded to.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

In cases where there is a perception that there has been denial of services--

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

On a point of order, Mr. Obhrai.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Sorry--

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

You will get your time.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

[Inaudible--Editor]

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Go ahead, Mr. Obhrai.

[Deepak Obhrai, Conservative, Calgary East, AB]

I didn't...[Inaudible--Editor]. Nevertheless--

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

What you referenced in your last intervention was actually a steering committee, and you quoted from it and I didn't say anything, so be careful what you say, Mr. Obhrai. I'm just stating the facts.

[Deepak Obhrai, Conservative, Calgary East, AB]

Nevertheless, for your information, if you do have questions where you don't get comfortable service, feel free to call my office. That's why--