Foreign Affairs Committee on Oct. 26th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

We now go to MP Bergeron for two and a half minutes.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

According to a study published in September by Save the Children Canada, only one person in five reports receiving the humanitarian aid promised, and a relatively low proportion of the residents of the hardest hit provinces, Balochistan and Punjab, have received humanitarian aid. In the case of Balochistan, the figure is 8.4 per cent, and for Punjab it is 25.8 per cent.

In your experience, are those figures accurate? What explains this situation?

[Usama Khan]

I'm not sure if I understood the statistics correctly, but the overall point I do agree with is that those percentages are probably correct in terms of the people who need aid, as a denominator, and the people who are actually receiving it.

Unfortunately, because of the amount of need that's there, with a province like Balochistan, where the road infrastructure isn't there and the aid agencies and the NGOs can't get to everybody who needs aid, there is a large gap. That's why, for example, with Islamic Relief, a quarter of our staff is based in Balochistan. That's where access is most difficult and that's where we feel communities and villages may be neglected by the local NGOs.

[Rahul Singh]

I would add that the need is so widespread and immense. It's throughout the country, and in different parts of the country the flood is in different stages. As you know, Dadu is still under water. Nowshera and other areas to the north are not. The local government has even made it so that you can't cross a provincial border with food because it's so widespread in terms of the need.

This is just a much bigger response. Remember, in 2010 when the floods hit here, 20 million people were affected. We thought that was the biggest event in the world. I remember leading the first team in for us into that. This is 33 million people; it dwarfs it.

It's just so widespread and there are so many people in need. That just means we have to double down on our resources and continue to work. That's why we need more effective funding mechanisms.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Mr. Bergeron, you have 20 seconds.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Does another witness want to add something?

[Dr. Aslam Daud]

I tend to agree. I don't have exact numbers, but I would say that we are not reaching out to all communities and all groups.

There is still a tremendous need that can only be achieved by having more partners on the ground and more organizations responding, because each organization has limitations. When you have a bigger group of organizations responding, then you'll be able to reach out to the maximum number of people.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you.

Now we'll go to Ms. McPherson for the final two and a half minutes.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm sorry that I had to step out during the testimony. I was, unfortunately, giving a speech in the House.

It's been very interesting to hear. I'm going to talk a little bit more about the climate impacts or climate financing. We know that Pakistan, of course, has contributed less than 1% to global warming, yet they are bearing the burden of climate change and the climate crisis.

Perhaps, Mr. Shariff, I'll just finish with you, if I could.

How could or how should Canada be financing climate mitigation and adaptation better? How could it be better delivered? How could we ensure that it is reaching the most vulnerable people, that it's using indigenous knowledge and that it is aligning with our feminist international assistance policy?

[Khalil Shariff]

Thanks very much, Mr. Chairman.

I think this is a really important question, and I'm sure I won't do it justice in the time we have. Let me say a couple things in terms of principles of work.

The first principle is that, worldwide, including in Canada, climate finance has had a very significant portion associated with debt and equity financing rather than grant financing. While I understand why that aspiration might be there, I think it's very optimistic to think that the dire climate needs we have can be adequately addressed through resources that are non-grant resources and that are going to have to be paid back somehow. There is absolutely room for so-called innovative finance work here, but I would say that it is a very particular response; it's not going to be the generalized response.

The second thing is that I think we probably have to be much more analytically precise about the specific issues, country by country, where we think we can make a real contribution. Let me take clean energy as an example. In many parts of the world, we have a situation where we have both climate fragility and energy poverty. That is to say, we need to expand massively the amount of energy available. At the same time, we're going to be much more conscious about carbon footprints. We need to bring a lot of innovation to the ability of countries to develop energy security plans that convert resources in those countries into sustainable energy sources. How expert are we at that right now? What's the relationship of our funding to that massive question?

The last example would be in agriculture. There is a massive opportunity for us to do much more in climate-smart agriculture. It's a very significant issue around the world. I think we have lots of opportunities to partner with communities. My sense is that if we walk toward communities with ideas here, they will run toward us.

We need to make a commitment, and I think that a lot of this is going to have to be grant.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Mr. Shariff.

Thank you, Mr. Singh, Dr. Daud and Mr. Khan. We are very grateful for each of you generously sharing your expertise with us. We're also very grateful for all of the extraordinary work you're doing on the ground in Pakistan. Thank you very much. You can rest assured that your observations will be reflected in the final report that will be prepared.

Yes, Mr. Chong.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I wonder if the committee could quickly adopt four housekeeping items, so that we can have a smoothly functioning committee from now until the end of November.

The first housekeeping item that I hope the committee will adopt is regarding the two budgets that the clerk prepared for us.

I move that the committee adopt the project budget for the study on the extreme flooding in Pakistan for the amount of $11,500, as well as the supplementary project budget for the briefing on the current situation in Haiti for the amount of $10,575.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

There actually should be three, if I'm not mistaken.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Okay, it would be all three budgets, yes.

I will move the third budget, which is the request for Bill S-223 for the amount of $5,225.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

The witnesses can leave if they would like. Thank you.

This is for Bill S-223, the extreme flooding in Pakistan and the situation in Haiti.

(Motion agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Very quickly, there is a second housekeeping item that I hope the committee can adopt to help the committee and the clerk. A statement was prepared by the analysts concerning the recent appearance of Evgenia Kara-Murza in front of our committee.

I think there was only one small change to the statement, which I think everybody supports.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Yes. It was by Mr. Genuis, which is reflected.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

I'm wondering if the committee would adopt that statement so that it can be sent out by you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Is there unanimous consent?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

The third item that I'm hoping we can do is to adopt the calendar, which the clerk has prepared and which the chair has distributed to members of the committee, to the end of November, so that the clerk can invite witnesses and prepare for November's meetings.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Is there unanimous consent?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.