Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Dec. 12th, 2006

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

That's why I'm questioning, because it's my understanding—and I'm talking about in committee, not in the written report—that it wasn't an issue when I brought it up. But thank you. It's not that it will change the outcome of the vote; it's just clarifying the background.

(Amendment negatived)

(Clause 23 agreed to)

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Colleagues, there are no amendments to clauses 24 and 25. Would the committee be willing to consider them as a group?

Madam Jennings.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

If I'm not mistaken, on clause 26, NDP-9 and NDP-10 were defeated or negatived, as was NDP-11, in which case you may wish to seek consent to treat clauses 24 through 27 as a group.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Thank you very much, Madam Jennings. That's most efficient.

Is the committee in agreement to grouping them?

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Are you including all of clause 26? Is that what's being proposed here?

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Clause 26, yes. All of those were negatived.

While I'm offering Mr. Dewar a moment there, Monsieur Guimond, did you have a comment?

[Michel Guimond, Bloc, Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC]

I have a comment to make about clause 24. I recommend it be carried on division. The Bloc does not agree with this clause as worded. I am not asking for a vote, but simply that clause 24 be carried on division.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

On clause 24, is that agreeable to the committee?

(Clause 24 agreed to on division)

(Clauses 25 to 27 inclusive agreed to)

(On clause 28)

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Moving on to clause 28, there is an amendment by the Bloc, amendment BQ-9, which you will find on page 35 in your packages.

Monsieur Guimond, would you like to introduce it?

Mr. Reid, please.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Lennox and Addington, ON]

I'm assuming, Mr. Chairman, that amendment NDP-12 was also negatived?

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Yes, it was. That's correct. Just for the record, amendment NDP-12 was negatived. Thank you.

Monsieur Guimond, would you please introduce your amendment.

[Michel Guimond, Bloc, Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC]

Mr. Chair, we have had the opportunity to introduce it a number of times. The committee has even agreed to meet with Mr. Blanchet, the chief electoral officer of Quebec. The purpose of this amendment is to implement what we refer to as bingo cards.

As you can see, we are asking in clause 28 that this responsibility be given to the clerk, who has enough time while the deputy returning officer gives the ballot to the elector, who goes to the ballot box behind them. No one else can be in front of them. Accordingly, the flow of the vote is guaranteed. The clerk simply checks off the elector's number in the voting section on an NCR form, a no carbon required form, available to all parties authorized by the chief electoral officer.

To further clarify the concept of “on request”, to avoid having a party look for this information every two minutes, I have specified the interval to be at least 30 minutes.

When I talk about identity—so that the people from the Privy Council do not think that information on identity could be forwarded to the general public and broadcast on the news—I am talking about a number. For example, elector number 122, whose name is Michel Guimond, voted between 9:30 and 10 o'clock. That is the information that would be provided.

I will close with a very important argument that I was saving for the end. For your information, during the recent by-election in Repentigny, this form was tested, on agreement with the returning officer for that electoral district. Representatives from the Liberal Party, the Conservative Party, the NDP, and the Bloc Québécois, of course, since we were the ones who implemented this form, were pleased. This worked quite well.

By the way, contrary to what Mr. Kingsely thinks, this will not entail the addition of an electoral official to the tune of $10.6 million across Canada, because the clerk is already being paid to do this.

I am sure every member of the committee will vote in favour of this amendment.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Thank you.

Are there any other comments? Mr. Lukiwski.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Just for the benefit of Monsieur Guimond, because I know he likes to make sure he wins votes when the Conservatives oppose, I say that we will be opposing this.

[An hon. member]

You will be opposing?

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

We will be opposing.

[An hon. member]

You're kidding.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

But Monsieur Guimond has assured me that you will win this vote, and I know he enjoys it more when he wins the vote when we have opposed, rather than unanimously.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Order, please. Thank you.

Are there any other comments on this amendment?

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(Clause 28 as amended agreed to)

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Colleagues, on your sheets, it may indicate that there are other amendments; however, they've been negatived.

I can therefore ask the committee if they'd like to deal with clauses 29 through 41 as a group. There are no amendments to these clauses now.

Mr. Dewar, please.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I have a question for the panel, because we have, as you said, negatived amendments around vouching and statutory declaration.

We did hear a witness statement about the concerns of citizens being able to vote if they don't have identification and someone then has to vouch for them. I'd turn to the example that we had from those who are working in our shelters, wherein there is a problem, and quite frankly, with people who are from first nations. There were some concerns about having proper identification, vouching, and people being on the list.

I just want to make sure I'm understanding what we have in front of us. What we have presently is that if someone doesn't have photo ID and needs to have someone vouch for them, the only way that can happen is if one person hasn't already vouched for someone else, and that one person has to be on the voters list.

What we're effectively saying is that people, citizens, can't be sworn in and can't get on the voters list to vote if they do not have someone from that riding who is on the voters list to vouch for them. That's the predicament. If that were to happen, then they wouldn't be eligible to vote. Is that correct?

[Natasha Kim]

In effect, that's true, but that's assuming there is no ID, including the two pieces that could be authorized by the CEO.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Of course, but that's when we get to the vouching process, right? That's the safety net, if you will.

After hearing witness statements and after going through the amendment process, I can't believe that's the intent of this committee. We are basically saying to people who don't have someone on the voters list to vouch for them—and we heard clearly from witnesses that this is the case, and as the advertisement went in the election, I'm not making this up—that this is a reality.

By way of omitting these amendments, Chair and committee, what we're saying is that this is just fine. I'll have to tell you, it's going to be very hard for anyone in my party to support that. So I'm just making sure that we're clear on what this is doing by way of not passing this amendment or having these vouching amendments. We're saying that is just okay.

[Marcel Proulx, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

On a point of order, I want to remind the committee that we have discussed this at length. We have had witnesses in here explaining to us how homeless people can vote, how they can make sure they have the right to vote, how they can identify themselves with the help of people from their different shelters and different organizations. I don't think that we need a sermon on what we have done and what we have not done. We have taken care of making sure that every Canadian who has the right to vote can vote.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Goodyear]

Are there any further comments?

Do we have agreement to deal with clauses 29 through 41 as a group? I am seeing agreement, so I will pose the question.

(Clauses 29 to 41 inclusive agreed to)

(On clause 42—Coming into force)