Procedure and House Affairs Committee on June 10th, 2021

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Minister LeBlanc, we're at the end of our time, but would you be able to table that just so I can look at what you guys have done? That would be really useful. Table some of those conversations with the government of Newfoundland so we know what we're going to be attacking—

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

I don't want to pretend that I can table a conversation I had—

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

That's okay—

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

—on a text or on the telephone with the premier, but—

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Fair enough.

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

—what we can do....

Much of it may just have been foolish exchanges, because he's been a long-time buddy of mine, but what I'll be happy to do is ask Al Sutherland and Manon to ensure that any of the documents that we prepared in the context of working on this legislation, background documents or stuff that we may have received from Elections Canada, or anything that's appropriate, will be sent to the committee .

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you, Minister. We'll follow up with that.

Mr. Turnbull, you have five minutes.

For our other committee members, as we go further along—I know there's not a lot of time—if anybody wants to give some time to Ms. May later, she is joining us here today. We don't really have extra time, so it would have to be a member's time.

Mr. Turnbull, go ahead. You have five minutes.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister, it's great to see you. Thanks for being here.

I know that this is an important piece of legislation, and it's great to have some of your time for you to answer our questions. One of the things that I feel is a little unfortunate and that I've heard mentioned in the House quite a few times by some of the honourable members from the opposition parties would be called, in my most charitable interpretation, hyperbole, but I think would be more correctly called misinformation. It's the implication that somehow these changes may be more permanent than I think is intended.

I think you mentioned in your opening remarks that there's a sunset clause built into the legislation. Could you give us a little more reassurance and maybe some specifics on how that works?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Mr. Turnbull, your headset is not plugged in or selected. Can you make sure, please?

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

My apologies. I don't know how that happened.

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

Madam Chair, I heard the question clearly. In the interest of time, if you're okay, I'm prepared to answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Did we receive translation of that question?

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Justin Vaive]

Yes, Madam Chair, we did.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Mr. Therrien is saying yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you. Go ahead, Mr. LeBlanc.

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

Thank you. It was nice to see Ms. May on the screen for a minute.

Mr. Turnbull, thank you for the question.

You're right. I think there has been some confusion—that might be the generous word for it—around the intention or the legal reality of these measures being temporary one-off measures for a potential election during a pandemic.

The Chief Electoral Officer was very clear. The suggestions he made in his report to Parliament last fall spoke of temporary changes that would sunset after the next election, should there be one in the context of a pandemic, or at a time where he concludes, based on the advice of the chief public health officer for Canada, that these measures are no longer required.

It is a technical question. I want Mr. Sutherland to ensure he can give the committee the very technical answer on why these provisions are not permanent. Mr. Turnbull, you raised an issue that's of legitimate concern.

Al, can you perhaps help Mr. Turnbull?

[Allen Sutherland]

Yes. I will have to do it without reference to the document, because of the challenges.

As Minister LeBlanc set out in his opening remarks, the legislation is temporary. The CEO can bring it to conclusion by simply providing notice in the Canada Gazette that the pandemic conditions no longer apply. If he does that without reference to a date, it's six months later, or he can do it with reference to a date, which could conceivably bring immediate termination to the application of the legislation.

Now, as Minister LeBlanc set out in his opening remarks, the CEO is required to consult with the chief public health officer—with Dr. Tam—and needs to be able to reach a conclusion that the pandemic conditions no longer apply. The legislation would then be null and void.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

Thank you for that clarification. It's very helpful.

I also wanted to go back to a previous remark and question. I don't think the minister had the full amount of time to truly respond to it effectively.

We have heard over and over again about the importance of mail-in voting and mail-in ballots and just how important that will be in the context of a pandemic election if one should actually happen.

Can you speak a little bit more about how the legislation includes measures for ensuring that mail-in options are more accessible?

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

Mr. Turnbull, thank you for that question.

I said this in my opening remarks, and I think Mr. Therrien alluded to it as well. We saw in British Columbia a sharp increase in the number of mail-in ballots in that provincial general election. British Columbia is a big province with large urban centres and disparate rural communities. There was a sharp increase in mail-in ballots. The same thing, of course, was true in the United States in the presidential elections held last fall.

We thought that one of the challenges—and I noticed it when I was doing my own mail-in ballot in 2019—was that I had to literally photocopy pieces of a driver's licence and a medicare card to show residency, and then follow the rules and mail it to the chief returning officer in my constituency. At that point he returned the voting kit to me by mail. I completed it and put the different sealed envelopes together. I properly voted for myself and then I returned the ballot to him.

It struck me that if you were a senior citizen.... I was lucky that I had people who could help me get the paperwork done. I think we can collectively think of ways to make it more accessible while still keeping it secure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

That's all the time we have.

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you, Minister.

We have very tight time, and I want to get to both Monsieur Therrien and Mr. Blaikie.

Monsieur Therrien, you have two and a half minutes.

[Alain Therrien, Bloc, La Prairie, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Since I have a number of questions, I would kindly ask the minister to keep his answers as short as possible, in the spirit of co-operation.

Bill C‑19 contains a slew of measures that would authorize the Chief Electoral Officer to take certain measures and disregard others. That would give returning officers greater power, would it not?

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

That's a very good technical question.

What we are proposing is broadening the discretionary authority of the Chief Electoral Officer so he can amend or adapt the provisions of the existing act to protect the health and safety of voters and polling staff. As I understand it, if the Chief Electoral Officer determines that a measure is not needed in a given region or for a particular reason, we will trust his judgment. I can follow up with a more detailed answer, if you like.

[Alain Therrien, Bloc, La Prairie, QC]

Yes, I would appreciate a more detailed answer.