Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Feb. 6th, 2007

[Gary Merasty, Liberal, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

So you give us the stats and then come to us—

[Rosemary Bender]

We can give you the stats; we let you answer the questions.

[Gary Merasty, Liberal, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

I declare it a crisis then. Can I have a motion to that effect?

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

We'll hear just a final question from the government side, and then we're out of time.

[Rod Bruinooge, Conservative, Winnipeg South, MB]

Perhaps I can just get you to go back to what you indicated in relation to water contamination. On page 14, you asked the question—and I think this is based on their perception—as to whether or not water is contaminated. Just looking at the 16% of people within urban centres who feel their water is contaminated, do you have any thoughts as to that statistic? Clearly, it's 16% of people who claim to be aboriginal and who are living in urban areas. I don't recall our cities across Canada having water crises as much as this number would indicate. Do you have a sense of why that number might be 16%?

[Marie Patry]

The key here is self-perception. If people perceive that their water is contaminated, that's what they will report. The only thing that comes to mind is people buying water from water-supplying companies because they think the water from their municipal system is not safe. It's quite large, so I would say that comes into it to explain the situation there. It's self-perception.

[Rod Bruinooge, Conservative, Winnipeg South, MB]

In terms of your overall numbers on aboriginal population, I'm just going back to what Jean was mentioning earlier on the topic of what the government, in the past, has been responsible for, that being status Indian housing. When we build the Métis population into any number we're utilizing, I would suggest that the number becomes overinflated, as the Métis people provide housing for themselves. I guess it becomes a situation in which I'm not sure—at least from the department's point of view—that the number is of the same use as it can be when it just represents the status Indian.

[Marie Patry]

When you're doing the analysis, you have the choice to remove the Métis, should you wish to exclude the Métis from your analysis. But the data are provided from all the aboriginal people. All the questions are asked to everybody. When you're using the data in your analysis, it's more a matter of deciding to exclude, or not, parts of the population.

[Rod Bruinooge, Conservative, Winnipeg South, MB]

But don't you think it could get lost on anyone taking a glance at the data that in fact there is this criterion that is quite different in relation to those specific groups?

[Marie Patry]

I'll defer to the policy department to decide where they go with that, but the data is available and you have a choice to use it or not in your analysis and research.

[Rod Bruinooge, Conservative, Winnipeg South, MB]

Thanks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

Actually, we're out of time. I'm going to thank the witnesses for the information provided to the committee. Thank you very much.

Mr. Lévesque.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Thank you.

At our last meeting, I made a request that some food be provided for us at noon. To my mind, the request applied for all meetings during which we continue our deliberations over the lunch hour. Generally speaking, we have activities immediately before and after our committee meetings, and therefore, we do not have enough time to eat. Consequently, I wish to reiterate my request.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

Mr. Lévesque, the policy with regard to lunches during committee meetings is going to be distributed. That will be provided to you.

We're not permitted to have a scheduled lunch even if the committee meetings are during the lunch hour. You can do it on an individual basis at the meeting if it is requested by a member, but we cannot schedule a lunch for every committee meeting.

I would ask the clerk for further clarification.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Bonnie Charron]

Just to add to that, we have a float of $5,000. It's not intended for working meals, it's intended as a float to cover unforeseen expenses. When I tried to make arrangements for the meals, they said we couldn't do it unless we wanted to go ahead and deplete those funds and use them for working meals. That would require a motion in committee.

I was told it contravenes the spirit of the financial management policy. Again, it's up to the committee if we deplete the $5,000, but we may need it for something else in the future.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

I'll give you a couple of minutes to think about that.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

It has all been thought out, Mr. Chair. As reasonable beings, we could have decided to sit at reasonable hours, taking into account the fact that like all other citizens, we need food.

[The meeting continues in camera]

[Public proceedings resume]

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

Now, it's moved by Mr. Albrecht that the draft report as amended be adopted and that the chair present the report to the House, and that the chair, clerk, and analyst be authorized to make such grammatical and editorial changes as deemed necessary without changing the substance of the report.

Mr. Lemay.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

I second the motion.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

All in favour?

I didn't include the words, “Pursuant to Standing Order 109, the committee requests that the government table a comprehensive response to the report.” I think that's understood.

[Anita Neville, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

I would include that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

You would? Okay.

Would you include that in your motion, Mr. Albrecht? Okay, so be it.

There is no group of our party that wants to have a dissenting opinion on this thing? I don't think so. Okay.

(Motion agreed to)

We're going to have the distribution of the report from the subcommittee. Can I have a motion to move back in camera for this?

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Let's go back to in camera!

[The Chair, Conservative, Colin Mayes]

Is there a motion by any of the members to move back in camera? Not willing? You want to stay in public? Okay, we'll deal with this in public.

Does everyone have a copy?

There are two recommendations that have come forward from the subcommittee. The first one is that the study on housing consist of the plan and the briefings by department officials, and that the briefings take the form of a status report focusing on progress made to date and relevant future plans.

Just to expand a little bit on that recommendation, the subcommittee feels that there is sufficient information with regard to housing, much of which was included in the briefing that was circulated on aboriginal housing. The committee decided that it would be best to hear what the department's progress on housing is, and then possibly have another witness, but not to begin a full study on housing.

Do any committee members want to comment on that?

Madame Crowder.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

Thanks, Mr. Chair.

My recollection is that with the variety of studies that have already been completed and the recommendations that have already been made, what the subcommittee felt very strongly was that it would be important to have a progress report that talked about where the current money is going, what the results were for it, and what the status is on some of the recommendations that have been made through CMHC and the Auditor General. I think we also had agreed that we would like to hear from INAC, CMHC, and probably Health Canada because of the mouldy housing situation. That will conclude it, but we wanted to be really clear about results.