Evidence of meeting #13 for Justice and Human Rights in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was statistics.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Brian Murphy Liberal Moncton—Riverview—Dieppe, NB
Good. Just briefly, I don't want to pick on Manitoba, but when we went to Winnipeg, it seemed it was a hub of certain activity. I see in slide 4 that in 2008, of the 14 gang-related homicides, six were in Winnipeg. Where were the others?
11:30 a.m.
Director, Headquarters, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We would have to get back to you to let you know the exact location. We're happy to do that with these data.
11:30 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Ed Fast
All right. Thank you.
We'll move on to Monsieur Ménard for seven minutes.
11:30 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
Thank you.
When we examine the statistics on crime attributable to young persons under 18 years of age, am I to understand that they are established based on the uniform crime report that police officers complete at the time of the offence?
11:30 a.m.
Chief/Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
That's correct.
11:30 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
Statistics are established at the time the crime is reported. However, in addition, the statistics concerning the prosecution of young offenders are different from those based on the uniform crime report, are they not?
11:30 a.m.
Chief/Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Yes. There are different statistics for youth in criminal court.
11:30 a.m.
Chief/Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Yes, I can provide a copy of the most recent youth court Juristat to the clerk of the committee, and there's also a release in July.
11:30 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
On page 3, we can see how the situation evolved in Quebec between 1998 and 2001. Then it went from 23 to seven to 15 to 18 and 24. Why did it decline that way?
11:30 a.m.
Senior Analyst, Policing Services Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
These numbers are provided to us by the police services. We would have to speak directly with those police services for the explanations as to why the numbers would change from year to year.
11:30 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
Perhaps I can speak to you about it. It's related to Operation Springtime 2001, which was the culmination of the Carcajou squad. That squad, whose objective was to combat organized crime, was established in late 1998, and its work ended, I believe, around the fall of 2001 with the arrest of 321 members of the Hells Angels. The group was decapitated.
Could that be an explanation?
11:35 a.m.
Director, Headquarters, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
It could be an explanation. We would have to go back and talk with the people who provided us with the data to confirm, but again, it could be.
11:35 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
Thank you.
Mr. Martin, you talked about the influence of gun control on violent crime. I don't understand what you conclude from that. Do you mean that better gun control generally makes it possible to reduce the level of violent crime?
11:35 a.m.
Prof. John Martin
I don't recall speaking to the issue of gun control. I did address the--
11:35 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
You cited the example of the methods used in the United States. You talked about the difference between the United States and Canada.
11:35 a.m.
Prof. John Martin
I didn't speak to gun control, sir.
11:35 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
Mr. Martin, do you think a minimum sentence of seven years in prison should be a deterrent?
11:35 a.m.
Prof. John Martin
It would be a deterrent for some individuals. It would not be a deterrent for someone who is very deep in the gang lifestyle. They would not be deterred by that type of sentence.
11:35 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
There was a time when the cannabis that grew in Canada did not have a hallucinogenic effect, as a result of which all marijuana and hashish came from outside the country. People at the time received a minimum sentence of seven years in prison for bringing those drugs into Canada.
Do you think it would be good to determine whether that very harsh sentence helped reduce marijuana consumption or whether, on the contrary, it contributed to increasing it? To determine whether there was an influence on drug imports to Canada, we could go back and examine the statistics on drug-related sentences during the following periods: the first, during which a minimum seven-year sentence was applied; the period during which it was no longer applied; and the period during which the Supreme Court declared that that minimum sentence was unconstitutional.
11:35 a.m.
Prof. John Martin
On the issue of marijuana and sentencing, I think if we look at the difference between British Columbia and Washington state, the story speaks for itself.
Washington state is very similar demographically to B.C. It has almost no grow ops. They are not a priority for law enforcement or for prosecution. British Columbia has tens of thousands of them.
Now, what's the difference? In Washington state, someone convicted of a major grow would do five years in the penitentiary. They would lose their home. They very likely would have children taken into state custody. In British Columbia, we would take their light bulbs.
11:35 a.m.
Bloc
Serge Ménard Bloc Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC
I don't believe my question was well translated, Mr. Martin, but I believe the Statistics Canada representatives understand it.
Would it be possible to go back to the past, as far back as the 1960s, when marijuana started to be used—