Evidence of meeting #49 for Justice and Human Rights in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was data.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We would only be able to report on the actual numbers that you see. We wouldn't be able to make any inferences between any legislation that was passed and the impact it had on the data.
NDP
Joe Comartin NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
In the period of time from 2000 to 2005, just so we're clear, with regard to both custodial sentences and the use of conditional sentences, there is a fairly flat line.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Yes, I would say it's a fairly flat line. There is some variation. We can provide you with the actual data underlying it, if you would like.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Ed Fast
Thank you.
Is there anyone on the government side?
All right. We will go back to the Liberals. Are there any other questions? None?
Go ahead, Monsieur Lemay.
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
I have studied the statistics that you provided to us and I am really very concerned. Indeed, we have been presented with Bill C-54, a bill that will apply from one end of the country to the other, and on which we are getting ready to vote. I am concerned by the number of offences in the Yukon, the Northwest Territories and Nunavut.
Colleagues, I am on slide 3.
Do you have the statistics for Nunavik, which is a region in Northern Quebec? I am not talking about Nunavut, but of Nunavik.
Senior Analyst, Policing Services Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We could certainly take a look at our data and the breakdown that we have. The RCMP polices that area in Nunavut, and we can look at a further breakdown.
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
We also see sexual offences against children aged 0 to 17 years on slide 3. Let us go back in time. In 2009, did sexual offences against children aged 0 to 17 years decrease, remain the same or increase in the Yukon, the Northwest Territories and Nunavut? I am talking here about those three territories, but the question also obviously applies to Quebec, Northern Quebec and Nunavik.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We would be able to provide trend information, going back in time, to the committee
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Do you not have these statistics for 2008? Have these offences increased since 2008? Has their number remained steady? I do not know if you have the statistics for 2007 and 2008 here, but you are telling us that you have been keeping statistics since 1999-2000. My impression is that there has been an increase, but I would like to know if such is the case or if the numbers have remained the same.
Senior Analyst, Policing Services Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We don't currently have that information with us. We'd have to go back to look at our databases to see whether it is possible to break it down by province and territory for previous years. It goes to the methodology of the way we collect the information. We might have to look at a subset of police services to be able to provide that information to the committee by province over time.
Chief and Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
For some offences, it may not be possible to break it out for a long period of time. Prior to 2008, a number of these offences were grouped into a much larger category.
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
I understand perfectly. I am not asking you for the impossible. I wish to know if there is a sense of some increase, given the new offences that will be established and these minimum mandatory sentences that will be imposed, were this bill, that we are preparing ourselves to vote on, ever adopted. I must say that I am very worried about this situation prevention-wise.
I took note of what you said earlier, Ms. McAuley. Indeed, it gives me even more the impression that there is an increase. Would it be possible for you to provide these statistics, for which you will have to do research, before March 1st? We are not sitting next week. If you could send them to us next week, it would be perfect.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We will go back to our offices, look at the data, and provide you with any information that we do have available.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Ed Fast
Do we have any other questions?
We'll go to Mr. Murphy and then Mr. Comartin.
Go ahead, Mr. Murphy.
Liberal
Brian Murphy Liberal Moncton—Riverview—Dieppe, NB
As I said, I apologize for not knowing this better, but a lot of what seems to create anxiety is the whole idea of luring over the Internet. There are some new offences here that respond to what are perceived to be problems, and I think they are.
It reminded me of earlier questions of earlier witnesses that were related to the many offences in the code under this category of sexual offences and corrupting public morals. Are you able to break down the offences by category, specific to the section of the code? I assume you have to do that to put them in here as a total.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Yes, we do, so we would be able to provide you with breakdowns if you like.
Liberal
Brian Murphy Liberal Moncton—Riverview—Dieppe, NB
I would appreciate that.
I know you've put it all together, and it's a very interesting overview. Can you tell us off the cuff if there has been an increase in crimes that involve the Internet?
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
We did a presentation either last week or the week before to the Senate standing committee, looking at exactly that. I don't have the slides or the background information in front of me, but I'd be happy to provide it to the clerk. Some of these are new offences that have recently been introduced into the Criminal Code, such as luring a child via the Internet, which was introduced in 2002.
We do see a trend in the number of incidents; however, there are a few things that you should be careful about when you look at those data. The first is that it does take a while for police services across the country to start charging people with those offences as they become more embedded in there. The other thing is that policing practices can have an impact on newer crimes related to the Internet. We don't know whether the inrease in offences or incidents is specifically related to increased activity or the creation of cyber-crime units within police services across the country. We can't disentangle that. All we call tell you are the actual numbers, and we can happily provide those.
Chief and Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
For the criminal court, if you turn to slide 23 in the supplemental section of the presentation, the offences that are included in the other sexual offences are broken down, and those are the charges that are completed in court in the cases that contain at least one of those charges.
Liberal
Brian Murphy Liberal Moncton—Riverview—Dieppe, NB
Well, child luring via the Internet—I'm sorry I didn't see this before—has spiked quite a bit since the Internet's inception. That's the second-last line.
Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
What we can say based on those data is that the number of charges of child luring via the Internet is increasing.
Chief and Advisor, Courts Program, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
This is different from police incidents. This is completed charges in a criminal court.
Conservative