Natural Resources Committee on Sept. 22nd, 2022

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Exactly. That's what I just said.

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

It's not debatable. We just need to go to a vote.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I'm just clarifying. If somebody asks what decision and what ruling, it's the ruling on the speaking order. That's what we're talking about.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Sorry; it's my challenge to your ruling that the speaking order can be challenged.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Yes, okay.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

You ruled that it can be challenged, and now we're voting on the question of whether your ruling in respect of allowing the challenge shall be sustained.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Right.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

A vote “yea” means you agree with the chair; a vote “nay” means you agree with me, which is the opposite of the way you took the vote on the previous challenge, which is part of the problem, but we'll get to that.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Okay. Shall the ruling of the chair be sustained? All in favour?

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

I asked for a roll call vote. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

We'll have to turn to the clerk for the roll call vote.

(Ruling of the chair sustained: yeas 7; nays 4 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

The decision of the chair on the speaking order is carried.

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

I do have the floor now, Chair—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

We've established as a result of that challenge that he has a right to challenge the chair. You said that a vote has taken place on that challenge, but I think clearly now maybe we recognize that the format of the vote was not proper, because the yeas in that case were considered as supporting the challenge and the nays were considered as opposing the challenge—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Come on, Mr. Chair—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

—when in fact the proper format—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Can we all go for lunch rather than listen to this idiocy?

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Chair, respectfully, to the member of the NDP who thinks rules and conventions are idiocy—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

The member is not respectful. He has insulted the chair. He's interfered. They shut down an indigenous chief from speaking. We had to listen to John A. Macdonald.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

—I'm not entirely surprised to hear that from that member, but as a Conservative I think rules and conventions are important. They're what sustain our Parliament, and I hope the member would reflect on the value of following the rules.

Now, Mr. Chair, because the vote was taken incorrectly, I suggest we simply retake the vote, with the question stated as “Shall the ruling of the chair be sustained”, with respect to Mr. Sorbara's challenge, because the vote was not properly taken. The question was not read and the votes were inverted, and that led to confusion, understandable confusion, because you were interpreting the yeas as nays and the nays as yeas compared to what is normally the proper approach when it comes to challenges to the chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I will take that, and we'll put it as a recorded vote to sustain the ruling of the chair on the new speaking order, which would therefore give Mr. Sorbara the first order of speaking.

That's what we will vote on now: that the ruling of the chair be sustained. We'll go to the clerk for a recorded division.

(Ruling of the chair sustained: yeas 12; nays 0)

We have support for that motion, and so the decision is that Mr. Sorbara is—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Sorry, Mr. Chair. You had previously ruled that I spoke next. We just voted on Mr. Sorbara's challenge to the chair, and the committee voted that the ruling of the chair be sustained, which means I have the floor now.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

No.

Come on, Chair, this is turning into a kindergarten circus.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

No, it is absolutely clear what the—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Chair, the committee voted to sustain the chair.

Conservatives all voted in favour. The motion was to sustain the ruling of the chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

The floor is now Mr. Sorbara's for his motion.