Official Languages Committee on Feb. 14th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Two members from the same party, acting independently, might ask the law clerk to draft something, and get the same text. That has happened in the past with the Bloc Québécois and the Conservatives.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

When you say the Bloc and the Conservatives, that's because we had heard the recommendations made by witnesses.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you for the question.

We will now move on to amendment LIB-12. I would point out that if it is adopted, amendment LIB-13 may not be moved, because it is identical, and amendment BQ-23 also may not be moved, this time due to a line conflict.

Mr. Beaulieu, the floor is yours.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

We are going to amend amendment BQ-23 and send you the new version, in which there will be no line conflict.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Perfect.

Mr. Drouin, the floor is yours on amendment LIB-12.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I move that Bill C-13, clause 21, be amended by replacing lines 1 and 2 on page 11 with the following:

The heading of Part VII and sections 41 and 42 of the Act are replaced by the following:

Advancement of Equality of Status and Use of English and French

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Beaulieu, the floor is yours.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I am going to vote against the amendment, even though I prefer that heading to the one proposed in the bill, because we do not believe that anglophones constitute a minority. There is only one minority official language, and that is French. There is only one official language that is in jeopardy, and that is French.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu.

Mr. Godin, the floor is yours.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Chair, I want to recognize the work done by my colleague Mr. Drouin, and his amendment. I think we are all endeavouring to achieve equality of status for the two official language.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

As there are no other questions, I will put this amendment to the vote.

(Amendment agreed to: yeas 10; nays 1)

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

We will not be studying amendment LIB-13.

Mr. Beaulieu, before suspending the meeting, you wanted to speak to amendment BQ-23. The floor is yours.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I have sent a new version, excluding point (a), which dealt with the heading.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Perfect. Have you circulated it?

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

We are going to circulate it.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Right.

We will suspend the meeting to allow time to read the new version of amendment BQ-23.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Resuming the meeting.

That took some time because the change to the amendment had repercussions on numerous other amendments that were going to be moved later. Before going any further, I want to say that numerous amendments could be affected.

Mr. Beaulieu, before we talk about your new amendment BQ-23, I have to tell the committee that if amendment BQ-23 is adopted, amendments CPC-21, BQ-27, BQ-31, CPC-26, LIB-14, LIB-15, BQ-32, CPC-28 and CPC-31 cannot be moved due to a line conflict. I would ask the parties concerned to take note of this.

We are well equipped here and we have the crème de la crème around us.

I see that it is 5:31, and we can extend the meeting by five or ten minutes at the most. Is there unanimous consent to finish the discussion on this amendment?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Perfect.

Mr. Beaulieu, the floor is yours.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I believe this is a very important amendment. For 52 years, positive measures under the Official Languages Act have served only to support the anglophone community and go against the Charter of the French Language, which seeks to make French the common and official language in Quebec in order to promote the inclusion of newcomers.

However, those positive measures support services in English in all sectors. Every time, it sends the message to newcomers that they have a choice between French and English and they don't need to learn French. We know, however, that in a context in which English is in the majority in Canada and in North America, it encourages newcomers to join the English side.

The right of the Quebec people to self-determination, the right to guarantee the future of the language of that people, is also in issue here. As we know, a language management method like the scheme imposed by the Official Languages Act, that is, undifferentiated institutional bilingualism, always ends up with assimilation of the minority languages in the world. The only countries where there is more than one national official language but the minority languages have not been assimilated are those countries where, in a particular geographic area, there is a common language. In Belgium and Switzerland, that doesn't prevent anyone from learning multiple other languages, but it guarantees the future of Flemish in Belgium or French in Wallonia.

So the purpose of the proposed amendment is to amend clause 21 of the bill.

In point (a), which refers to French and English, we propose to replace lines 13 and 14 on page 11 with the following:

due to the predominant use of English and that it is the official and common language of Quebec, is committed to protecting and promoting the French language while respecting the linguistic development of Quebec provided for in the Charter of the French Language.

We add that French is the official language, and that raises the question of whether it is possible to guarantee the future of French in Canada. Personally, I think that if there is no way to obtain arrangements that comply with the Charter of the French Language, that means there is no way to guarantee the future of French in Canada.

It would be progress to admit that French is in decline. It would be further progress to agree to a certain form of asymmetry by saying that French is in the minority in Canada and North America. Quebeckers who speak French are part of that minority, while anglophones are part of the anglophone majority in Canada.

Historically, English has played a dominant role in Quebec. Anglophones have their overfunded institutions and the current positive measures are contributing to keeping them overfunded, and this operates to anglicize newcomers and francophones.

In point (b), which deals with positive measures, we propose to replace line 32 on page 11 with the following:

subsections (1) to (3) and to respect the linguistic development of Quebec provided for in the Charter of the French Language.

In point (c), which deals with the different needs of the anglophone and francophone communities, we are replacing lines 10 to 13 on page 12 with the following:

(ii) the necessity of considering the specific, different needs of each of the two official language communities of Canada, and (iii) the necessity of protecting and promoting French in Quebec, taking into account that French is the official and common language of Quebec; and

Last, point (d) proposes to amend line 15 on page 13 to require that the Canadian government also consult the provincial and territorial governments before imposing measures.

That summarizes all of the points in amendment BQ-23 that I believe to be important. If there is a genuine desire to protect French in Quebec, there has got to be some flexibility and adaptability in the positive measures, to respect the minority character of French in Canada and North America.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu.

Mr. Godin, the floor is yours.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

I have a comment to add, Mr. Chair.

I understand and I hear what my colleague has said. However, amendment BQ-3, which has been adopted, inserted the Charter of the French Language into the preamble to the act. Because the preamble is the inspiration for the meaning to be given to the entire act, I think this amendment is unnecessary.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

No one else wishing to speak, we will put amendment BQ-23 to the vote.

(Amendment negatived: nays 10; yeas 1)

Before adjourning the meeting, I would like to thank the experts from the various departments and the clerks and analysts for the time they have give us.

Mr. Beaulieu, do you want to add something?

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I want to quickly make a comment.

To continue my summary, I would note that so far we have studied 20 clauses out of 71. We have got to page 61 of 229 in the bundle of amendments. However, we have only two meetings and another hour of work left to finish everything.

I raise the question because I think it is important, whether for Quebec or for francophones outside Quebec, that we be able to study all the amendments to the bill.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu.

Thanks to the whole team. Thanks to the committee members and to everyone.

The meeting is adjourned.