Status of Women Committee on Oct. 31st, 2006

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Why don't we withdraw the amendment and vote on the motion?

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I have to go to Ms. Mourani, because she indicated she wanted to move an amendment.

Ms. Stronach is considering withdrawing her amendment. Do you want to place your amendment to Ms. Smith's motion, or just vote on Ms. Smith's motion?

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

I will put forward my amendment, if you will. I will read it slowly.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), that the Standing Committee on the Status of Women recognize that, in fact, all women are not equal in Canada and that it is becoming urgent that we take concrete measures to address the inequalities experienced by women, including the implementation of pay equity legislation.

Therefore, some parts are deleted.

The committee also recognizes that the Conservative government does not strive to address the barriers that would prevent the full participation of women in Canadian society, so that the economic, social, political, legal and cultural situation is improved across Canada.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Ms. Smith.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I believe probably that's a whole new motion, and so I would suggest that Ms. Mourani put her motion forward at another time and we deal with it at another time.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

It is an amendment. Madam Chair, I have added “does not”. I have removed “under the Constitution and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms”. I have amended that and have kept whole phrases, such as “strive to address the barriers that would prevent full participation”, etc.

It is an amendment, Madam Chair, not a change. The motion as presented states that the current government recognizes that women are equal, and that it is trying to improve their economic, social and cultural conditions. What my amendment says is that the government does not strive to address those barriers and that, in fact, women are not equal.

It is exactly the same motion, except for the part saying that the government strives to address the barriers and that all women are equal. And there is an amendment stating that that is simply not the case. I have therefore moved an amendment, not a complete change.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that it's exactly the opposite of what Ms. Smith's motion says. It might be much more advisable, Ms. Mourani, to bring that in as a completely separate motion, as it is now. Unless I've missed something, it seems to me that it's contrary to what Ms. Smith's motion says.

Do you want to speak to it, Ms. Mourani?

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Yes, Madam Chair.

That side of the table may very well move a motion stating that all women are equal and that the government strive to address the barriers. However, the amendment that I am presenting basically says that that is not true. Madam Chair, in my view, that is untrue. That is what I believe, that is my opinion. I did not change anything. I remove the part of the sentence: “under the Constitution and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms”. I added another phrase and the words “does not”. I therefore amended the motion.

It is not a new proposal, it deals with the same issue: women's equality and the barriers that we strive to address. It is the same thing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

It's the same subject, but it's exactly the opposite of what Ms. Smith is trying to gain in her motion.

I would suggest that you table a motion saying whatever it is you want to say for our next meeting, but for today I would have to suggest that we're going to go forward with the motion as it is in front of us. If you don't agree with it, vote it down, and I would suggest that you present a motion at our next meeting, Ms. Mourani, that outlines the issues you're concerned about.

Yes, Ms. Mourani.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

It is the same issue.

I would like to know what the rules are regarding the amendment. I would like for the clerk to give us an answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I'll ask the clerk.

[The Clerk of the Committee]

I can read an excerpt:

An amendment must be relevant to the main motion. It must not stray from the main motion but aim to further refine its meaning and intent. An amendment should take the form of a motion to: leave out certain words in order to add other words; leave out certain words; or insert or add other words to the main motion.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

That is what I have done, Madam Chair. I have added and left out words. I have deleted words, and I will point them out to you. No, but it is true—

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I don't agree with you.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

I recognize that “in fact, all women are not equal in Canada” and have added the words “does not”. I have left out “under the Constitution and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms” and have added “it is becoming urgent that we take concrete measures...”. I have added words here, and left out words there, and have made an amendment. That is exactly what I have done.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

It completely changes the intent of Ms. Smith's motion, which is before us, so I cannot accept your amendment, Ms. Mourani. I suggest you put a motion in place for the following meeting, if you like.

Ms. Stronach--and I'm keeping my eye on the clock, please.

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

I withdrew my amendment based on Ms. Mourani's motion, but now that you're ruling that it's not admissible, I'd like to reinstate my amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Do we need to read the amendment? Is everybody clear on what the amendment is?

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

No. We had suggested that we could support that amendment with the first part about reinstating equality. That is not the intent. We are saying here that's something different again. We would totally disagree there, Madam Clerk, so I would suggest that maybe Ms. Stronach could bring in another motion as well.

The whole essence of this is to say that women are equal in Canada, and “reinstate equality” infers that we don't believe women are equal in Canada. It definitely takes away from my motion, and I would be so kind as to ask members opposite just to put another motion forward that reflects their own view, because this amendment is contrary to what our whole motion is talking about.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Would you like to split that amendment into two parts?

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

No, I do not want to split the amendment, number one. If it's admissible, I'd like that it be voted on.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Let's read it out again and make sure.

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Do you want just the amendment or the full motion? Do you want the entirety?

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Yes, please.

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

It says:

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), that the Standing Committee on the Status of Women recognize that all women are equal in Canada under the Constitution and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and that the government reinstate equality as the primary goal of the women's program at Status of Women Canada and strive to address the barriers that would prevent the full participation of women in Canadian society, so that the economic, social, political and legal aspects, and cultural situation is improved...