Veterans Affairs Committee on April 12th, 2016

[Bernard Butler]

Yes, the $1.6 billion is the value over the next five years.

[Alupa Clarke, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I understand what you are saying.

[Bernard Butler]

That's the actual amount forecast to be spent on those program elements.

[Alupa Clarke, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

The Fiscal Monitor, published by the Department of Finance, says that, since the election, there has been a $5.4-billion deficit. The report says that a large part of that deficit is due to the increase of veterans benefits. If I understand correctly, a $3.7-billion amount will indeed be used automatically to cover the benefit increase. Is that correct?

[Michel Doiron, Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs]

I think it is, but I would like to refer these questions to our chief financial officer. We can answer questions about our programs and tell you how much money is spent, but we cannot talk about actuarial value and discrepancies in terms of figures. I would not want to mislead anyone. I think that Ms. Stuart or Maureen Sinnott would be in the best position to provide detailed answers to any questions about the department's finances. My colleague and I are not accountants, and I would not want to mislead you, Mr. Clarke.

[Alupa Clarke, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I understand.

Let's talk about the reopening of offices. Some veterans would like to know about transparency. How will that be organized? Do you think those offices will provide treatment deliveries, or will they be limited to case management?

[Michel Doiron]

The 10 offices, in addition to the one we will open—the office in the north will not be permanent—will be based on the demand of that region's clientele, just like our current offices. People will be able to meet with their case manager.

Each office will be mixed in nature. What they will have will be based on the number of clients in that location. There will be case managers, veteran service agents, nurses and other stakeholders to provide our veterans with comprehensive services. Those are not mental health clinics. They are offices just like the ones in our current network.

[Alupa Clarke, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Okay.

I will give my remaining time to my colleague.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

My question is in regards to the veterans independence program. I see an increase in that program over time. These are services to help them live at home, right? What's the expectation there?

[Michel Doiron]

The veterans independence program is to allow veterans to remain in their homes as long as possible before going to a long-term care facility or maybe a hospital. The value has been increasing, both because more and more veterans are making use of it, and because, as our veteran population is getting older, some of their needs are growing. That's where the difference in cost is. We do believe it will continue to go up a bit—I won't say substantially—as the veteran population ages, to give them the services they need.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

I appreciate that. I think everyone has a better quality of life and mental health when they have the opportunity to stay at home as long as possible.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Okay, thank you.

Mr. Bratina.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

One of the priorities identified in the mandate letter is to work with the Minister of National Defence to reduce complexity, overhaul service delivery, and strengthen partnerships between Veterans Affairs and National Defence.

Could we discuss what the complexities involve?

[Michel Doiron]

Transition has been identified by some of the research. My partner can talk about the research more than I can, but transition is that difficult part when somebody leaves. We are working with our partners in the Canadian Armed Forces to work with the transitioning member—because they're not a veteran yet—upstream. The moment we know that they will be leaving the Canadian Forces and that they have needs, we start working with them, so that the day they take the uniform off is not a shock. The complexity is that there are many people involved in the process, whether it be our case managers under Veterans Affairs, or those under CAF, DND, or SISIP. What we're trying to do is accelerate the service and simplify the process for the member so that it's not a big black hole when they get there, and take care of them throughout the process.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

It's surprising to me, in a way, that we're still in that situation.

A member of my family who was in the armed forces and retired probably 20 years ago, after 20 years in the service, told me that it was a hard landing leaving the forces. She said that wherever she went in the world she would be looked after; there was a place for her to go, a hierarchy, and everything she needed to feel comfortable, which completely came to an end.

I'm surprised that we're at the stage where we're still trying to solve that.

[Michel Doiron]

I can't speculate on why it has taken so long, but I do agree that it's still a hard landing for some folks. The wellness model of care, compassion, and respect, which has been put forward by the deputy minister and the minister, aims to try to soften that landing, understanding that for some people it will be difficult regardless. It aims to ensure that while they're still in uniform they receive as much care as they can before they leave, but also that they are educated on what to expect, whether in health care, employment, or various items, so that at least it's not as unknown when they actually leave the forces. We are progressing down that road.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

We heard the minister talk about forming advisory groups to help with consultation on veterans' issues. Could you give us more on the scope and purpose of advisory groups?

[Bernard Butler]

You're absolutely right; the minister is very committed to the idea of engaging and consulting with stakeholders. There's no doubt that, as we move forward as a department with our programming, we really need to better understand where the needs of Canada's veterans are, as they see them. The minister has instructed the department to establish six advisory groups dealing with issues like policy, service excellence, families, care and support, commemoration, and so on. Basically, through those strategies, we will sit down with representatives of veterans' organizations, individual veterans, and so on, and get them to help us map the way forward. When it comes to programs or budget commitments, such as the veterans' education benefit that was referred to in the budget, we'll be consulting with stakeholders to ask, “What should that look like? What does that mean to you?” The budget committed to a comprehensive financial benefits review. Going forward, we'll consult with stakeholders to get them to give us a sense of what their needs are, how they see that, and how best the department can meet those needs. That's the context.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Is there work being done on a veteran's identity card? Is that something that's under consideration?

[Michel Doiron]

Yes, we're looking into that, exploring the options.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Ms. Mathyssen.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, it's good to see you again.

I've been thinking about this question of services and how very important the services are that are provided by Veterans Affairs Canada. There are also external routes that have some very innovative approaches. I'm thinking right now, for example, of the Wounded Warriors, and the canine and equine therapies that they have been using and exploring. I've heard a great deal of positives about both of those.

I've also heard a lot from the Legions and real concern expressed about the fact that the poppy funds in legions are being utilized to provide services where there is a vacuum.

The question is, does the department reach out to those groups like the Legion, like the Wounded Warriors, like all of those wonderful folks who have come together to help and have been innovative? Do you connect with them in terms of what VAC might be able to provide beyond what is currently in the lexicon?

[Bernard Butler]

The answer is absolutely, yes. I think it's fair to say that when it comes to issues around veterans programming, many of the issues are so complex that they really require engagement with a wide range of partners, other government departments, and so on.

If I use the example of homelessness, and the minister spoke to that earlier this morning, there's no doubt that Veterans Affairs can't solve all of these issues by itself, but it can take a very active role in engaging with other government departments like ESDC, like CMHC, with organizations like the Royal Canadian Legion, like VETS Canada and so on to help identify and understand and advance the issues in the interests of veterans.

When it comes to innovative methodologies for engaging with treating or supporting veterans, the answer is absolutely, yes. We have, for example, issues around equine therapy and canine therapies. We understand there are a lot of organizations out there having considerable success in those areas.

From a Veterans Affairs Canada point of view we look at those strategies, we look at what folks are doing, and we engage with those partners. At the present, for instance, we are supporting a number of research initiatives to try to understand what is out there, what these kinds of therapies might offer. On the basis of that type of research, we'll then develop and adopt policies and practices that are evidence-based and we believe will ultimately serve the interests of veterans well.

Absolutely, we're very much engaged with third parties on a broad spectrum, a broad continuum to try to understand where innovative thinking is, where there may be opportunities to try to then validate them and then develop programs and policies that will incorporate them into the way forward.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you.

The 2014 Auditor General's report was quite a significant report. The auditor found that the application process for the disability benefits program was very complex and said that decision-making was slow.

The department also found that there needed to be a better process in terms of mental health strategies for veterans, that there also was a need for performance measures to be put in place, and the department agreed. My questions are the following. What actions have been taken to make the application process for disability benefits less complex? What action has been taken in terms of speeding up decision-making? And what measures are in place to assess the performance of mental health strategies?