Evidence of meeting #25 for Veterans Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was contract.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you.
I now invite Mr. Peter Julian to take the floor.
You have six minutes. Go ahead, please.
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NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Harris, I want to come back to this issue of no new medical and psychosocial resources from October 25 to November 22, 2022.
We have a copy of a slide from part of the training that was offered through Veterans Affairs that says exactly that, and I will quote it: “no new medical and psychosocial resources from Oct. 25-Nov. 22, 2022”. Will you provide to the committee all of the copies of the slides that were presented to employees in Veterans Affairs?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I haven't seen that slide.
Nathalie, I don't know if you want to talk about, as you did, the direction that was given.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
I am specifically asking if you will provide to this committee copies of the slides that were provided to employees.
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
Yes, of course.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
Thank you.
My second question is related to the minister's meeting with the union. Can you confirm that the minister has not met with the union president for nearly a year now?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I unfortunately can't speak to the minister's meetings with the union. You would have to ask the minister.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
My third question is related to the issue of the current caseload that most employees are carrying. Caseworkers, we've heard in testimony, are carrying anywhere from 40 to 60 veterans. We know how important it is to provide the utmost services to veterans. Can you confirm that this is indeed the case?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
In fact that's not correct. The average is about 30 to one for case managers with respect to veteran workloads.
There are differences, and it does change over time. In some cases, new case managers coming on may have a reduced caseload as they build up their skills and competency. In other cases, there may be periods of time in which people either have limitations or have different abilities in terms of being able to deliver on a caseload. The average caseload is about 30.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I believe Ms. Vaillancourt offered some issues earlier. It is somewhere in the neighbourhood of 60, for any variety of reasons. It could be maternity leave, family-related leave, education leave or illness.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
I'm just doing the figures. If that figure is right, you're basically confirming the union's figures, which means a caseload of at least 40 veterans per employee. Can you provide the committee with figures to give us a sense of what the case workload is currently?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I can, certainly. I don't think Ms. Vaillancourt provided any information around the fact that, yes, while some people leave either for new jobs or on illness or maternity leave, for example, people are also replaced on a short-term basis with term or acting opportunities to ensure that we're able to support veterans and continue with the balance in the caseload.
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NDP
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
We have 50 temporary caseworkers now—
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Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
—for three years. The indeterminate number of caseworkers for us is 426.
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NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
I think that confirms the figure she provided.
As far as the contract is concerned, what is the anticipated profit margin or net income to the company?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I can't speak to the percentage of income.
There are two elements to the contract. One element is administration—in other words, the work they do as part of what was just described to support veterans. Then there's what would be considered the payments to the providers in terms of health or medical or psychosocial services. If a veteran needs to go visit a psychiatrist as part of their rehabilitation, that's paid through the contract as well.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
What are the penalties for non-compliance by the company?
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Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I'm not sure offhand if I have the penalties in front of me, actually.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I'm not sure we can provide the entirety of the contract, because there are some elements that are proprietary in terms of the basis of payments and some other things. The statement of work was available as part of the contractual process.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
Yes, but I'm asking you for the contract. Could you provide that to the committee?
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs
I will work with my team to see what can be released, including whatever is not proprietary.