Environment Committee on May 10th, 2018

[Ed Fast, Conservative, Abbotsford, BC]

We're trying to persuade your members here that this is a good amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Okay, what do want the officials to answer to?

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Again, the concept is that uranium mines and thorium mills are treated differently from other mines under this act, and this amendment says that they're mines like all other mines.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Okay, let's have the officials speak to that.

[Christine Loth-Bown]

With respect to mines, I believe you mentioned earlier that they're also provincially regulated. The amendment that the Liberals made under 27, I believe, which was a change to 39(1) would mean that an integrated review panel could also include working with another jurisdiction, so mines could be dealt with through dealing with another jurisdiction, as well, so provinces and territories could be involved in the review, based on that amendment that was passed.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

But there's no need to differentiate between uranium and thorium mines, right?

[Christine Loth-Bown]

The uranium mines are under the Canadian Nuclear Safety and Control Act, so they're under the purview of the life-cycle regulator and they're controlled under that act.

I don't know if my colleagues from NRCan have anything further to add with respect to that, but it is the legislation.

[Jeff Labonté, Assistant Deputy Minister, Major Projects Management Office, Department of Natural Resources]

As it currently stands, uranium mines are subject to the Canadian Nuclear Safety and Control Act and require a federal certificate or licence to operate.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I have a question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

You know what? We're digging down into something. We've all had this in front of us since last—

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

It's related to exactly what Mr. Sopuck's issue is. I just want clarification that if the minister refers, she can still do a joint panel. Is that clear in the act?

[Christine Loth-Bown]

The change that was just put forward under amendment LIB-26 was to be able to ensure that an integrated review panel did not preclude involving another jurisdiction such as a province, territory, or indigenous jurisdiction in the review.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

An integrated review panel: what's that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Can we focus on this one? I think the answer given was that it's included.

Given the answer we got from the officials, I'm not really clear as to why this needs to be there, but you would like it voted on, so we're going to vote on it.

Shall the amendment carry?

[Ed Fast, Conservative, Abbotsford, BC]

Could we have a recorded vote?

(Amendment negatived: nays 6; yeas 3)

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

We are now on amendment PV-46.1.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Wait. Hold on, sorry.

Just to be clear, the legislative clerk is making sure that I'm very detailed here and that we know that the vote that we just took also applies to amendment CPC-5.2 because it's exactly the same. So that is now off.

We will go back to amendment PV-46.1.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Chair, I can set out the overarching principle here, because it will come up in many places since we have at this point failed to remove energy regulators, which have no business being in impact assessment. This is a legacy of Stephen Harper. There is no justification for the Liberal Party, which voted against this in spring of 2012, to now foist upon all future impact assessments a role for the NEB—now the CER—as well as offshore boards and the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission, despite recommendations from the expert panel and environmental law groups that appeared before you. I don't know how this is still being controlled by Stephen Harper from the political grave, and not the Liberals, who promised to do better. Having failed to get energy regulators out of the act, where they have no place—

[Ed Fast, Conservative, Abbotsford, BC]

Give me a break, Elizabeth.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

I'm sorry, Ed, that's what happened. I was there.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Ms. May, we are short on time.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

I'm explaining a series of amendments that are complicated in one overarching...so it's easier next time.

Having failed to get energy regulators out of this act, I'm proposing that we ensure that it's no more than one energy regulator on any panel, or as a member of those boards. This amendment deals with the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission. There will be subsequent ones that deal with others, and only one, and that they not serve as chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Mr. Amos.

[William Amos, Liberal, Pontiac, QC]

I'd like to speak to this one. We have heard from stakeholders that they'd like to see no majority of members from life cycle regulators on panels. That's something we've heard, so we're in agreement there with Ms. May. LIB-30, that is coming up, will address that, and we think it achieves that in the most balanced way.