Justice Committee on March 23rd, 2021

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

In a previous life, before I was elected, I worked predominantly in the 13 first nations communities in Nova Scotia. There's an assumption by many that with monies, for example, around education, that everyone gets funding. That's not the case, as you know all too well. Sound investments need to be made.

I really appreciate both you and Chief Delisle talking in great detail as to how we can look at this as an opportunity, and I appreciate your historical context.

I have a question for both of you. Are there other communities that you would look at, if this amendment were to happen, as a best-practice first nations community, or an Inuit community that you would look to in terms of using their successes as blueprints?

[Chief Michael Delisle Jr.]

Thank you, Mike, and you did pronounce my name correctly.

Mike to Mike, yes, absolutely, and Chief Deer mentioned earlier.... I just want to go back to the first question you asked.

We've developed internal funds, both for individuals as well as business: the Kahnawake emergency measures fund and the business interruption fund. We've poured literally millions of dollars directly from our established online gaming business back into the pockets of individuals, whether it be people in the community who have lost jobs because of COVID, people who have worked across the border who cannot do that because of COVID, and businesses that have had to shut. Based on our own task force that has kept us very safe over the past year-plus now, millions of dollars have been poured into that.

Going back to the new question you asked, we've looked to our sisters and brothers—and thank you, Mr. Badawey, for acknowledging the land that you sit on—in Six Nations and other places to establish something similar to what we've been doing here in Kahnawake for the past 25 years with other online gaming, through Mohawk Internet Technologies and the Kahnawake Gaming Commission doing licensing.

They are looking to establish a fund to be able to help clean water, not only in Kahnawake but beyond our borders as well. I have to say it this way: There was a failure of the Canadian government to be able to bring our people out of third world type of resources that they do not have. We don't sit on any type of natural resource here. We've been very ingenious in terms of bringing that forward.

Thank you for the question.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Thank you to you both.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you, Mr. Kelloway.

Last but not least, we'll go to Monsieur Fortin for two and a half minutes.

Go ahead, sir.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

My question is for Mr. O'Donnell.

Could you tell me what your views are on the issue of whether or not to exclude racehorse events from Bill C-218? Bill C-13 excluded them while Bill C-218 includes them. My understanding is that they should be excluded, in your opinion.

I would like to know why horse racing, as opposed to any other sport, should be treated differently.

[Bill O’Donnell]

Well, we're an industry by ourselves. Whatever money comes in, that's how we survive. They call it the sport of kings. It's really not a sport of kings. It's a hard-working bunch of agriculture, grassroots people who own horses and try to race them for purse money to feed their families basically, and do all the other things they do with horses—feed them, raise them, breed them and whatnot.

Our fear is that we're going to be left out of this altogether. As Mr. Levy said, and I commend him, we should be protected somehow. If they're betting on our product, we just want a little piece of that, and to be protected and get some money back to help run our organization, our industry. The black market bets on our racing. No matter what they do on any sport or anything they bet on, those industries don't receive anything back.

I think that's the most important thing, that we have to be included somehow.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

You have significant expenses and we understand that. However, if I compare the expenses of horse racing to the expenses of the National Hockey League, I think that the costs related to hockey games are quite high. I wonder why the same reasoning would not apply to horse racing. I understand that this may not be an easy question to answer.

[Bill O’Donnell]

I think any of the other sports operate on admissions, sponsorships, TV deals. All we have is the people who bet on the races. That's the only income we have on the horse side. On the horse people's side, we share in the revenue, whereas racetracks have food and beverage sales. We don't share in the food and beverage and admissions. It's only the commissions from betting directly on the horses that provide us with purse money and Sires Stakes money, to be more specific.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Mr. O'Donnell.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you, Mr. Fortin.

That concludes our second hour of panellists. I'd like to take this time to thank all our witnesses for their very important testimony and your remarks today.

If you would like to provide further clarification for the committee, I would ask that you please send that to our committee clerk as soon as possible so we can include it in our deliberations.

I have a very quick reminder for the members that the deadline for submitting amendments for Bill C-218 is today at 4 p.m. If you have any questions or any issues with that, please don't hesitate to reach out to me or to the clerk as well.

Thank you all very much.

I adjourn this meeting.