Evidence of meeting #117 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was standards.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Marina Mandal  Assistant General Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association
Mary Ann McColl  Professor, Queen's University, Canadian Disability Policy Alliance
Teri Monti  Vice-President, Employee Relations, Royal Bank of Canada
John Barlow  Foothills, CPC
Tasmin Waley  Senior Legal Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association
Gordie Hogg  South Surrey—White Rock, Lib.
Kerry Diotte  Edmonton Griesbach, CPC
David Errington  President and Chief Executive Officer, Accessible Media Inc.
Robert Lattanzio  Executive Director, ARCH Disability Law Centre
Scott Shortliffe  Chief Consumer Officer and Executive Director, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Kerri Joffe  Staff Lawyer, ARCH Disability Law Centre

October 23rd, 2018 / 9:40 a.m.

Kerry Diotte Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

To the banking representatives, thanks for outlining some of the good stuff you've done. It looks like there's been significant progress.

I'm lucky enough to be an able-bodied person, yet I frequently have accessibility problems when trying to get through to a local branch or to a live person and in trying to navigate overly complicated websites to find features. How much more difficult is that for people with disabilities?

9:40 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association

Marina Mandal

I'll start.

As we said in our opening remarks, we do see this as a journey, right? Also, I think that other stakeholders, not just the banking community or the private sector, see it as a journey.

There is a huge amount of innovation in the banking space, as there is in many other industries. It can often mean that we're not communicating, that the communication out to customers and clients might not always come perfectly in sync with the evolution of the products and services, but going back to my point a little earlier, I can tell you that customer service is the core of our business. The banks don't exist without customers, period. To the extent that persons with disabilities or persons who are able-bodied are challenged in finding information at a branch or on a website, I'd say that banks are there to help.

9:40 a.m.

Vice-President, Employee Relations, Royal Bank of Canada

Teri Monti

We do train people in customer service. We do try to make our websites and all of our information as accessible as possible to everybody. We are on a journey. We have said that. This is very much a journey.

We are looking for opportunities to improve, absolutely, and this legislation will give us a more harmonized view and the opportunity to get feedback to help us get there as we go through this process.

9:40 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

One of the things that helped me recently with a problem with Shaw, I think it was, was the feature of live chat. You get frustrated. You can't reach anybody. You're on hold. Are banks going that route? Do they have that now? Is it accessible for people with disabilities as well?

9:40 a.m.

Vice-President, Employee Relations, Royal Bank of Canada

Teri Monti

We do. We have a number of channels that people can use to reach out to us, including live chat on our websites. These are accessible through multiple formats.

9:40 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

Do any of you have any ideas regarding amendments that could be used for this bill?

9:40 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association

Marina Mandal

We don't have amendments in mind for Bill C-81. Some of the considerations that we put forward to the government as we engaged over the last two years actually would end up relating more, I think, to the standards, whether it's a balance between a principles-based approach and a prescriptive approach, or harmonization with the provincial jurisdictions that have accessibility legislation. Our concerns or considerations have been more in that direction, but not with regard to the text of the bill itself.

9:40 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

I think both banking representatives talked about how a lot of progress has been made, but how there are still barriers for people with disabilities. Can either of you give me some examples of the barriers that still exist?

9:40 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association

Marina Mandal

I think one we can point out—and again, it's a point about how innovation happens and how there might be a bit of a gap or a lag time—is touch screens. A lot of people are banking on mobile now, and those touch screens might not be accessible to everybody, although there's a lot that the banks and our vendor partners have done to bring the technology forward and make it more accessible. That's an example I would use.

9:40 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

Ms. Monti, do you have any examples?

9:40 a.m.

Vice-President, Employee Relations, Royal Bank of Canada

Teri Monti

There are individual situations, because each individual, obviously, presents different capabilities and different disabilities. We do find, occasionally, individual issues with the location, parking and things like this that can act as barriers.

9:40 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

I'll stay on that note. Obviously banks are going to a model of taking away the neighbourhood locations and going to farther satellite locations, merging three or four branches into one. How does that impact somebody with a disability?

9:45 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Canadian Bankers Association

Marina Mandal

With regard to branch closures, they're always happening in consultation with the community. It's definitely not an easy decision. Part of that consultation in determining whether to have a physical location involves consultation with all of the impacted customers. There are alternative ways to deliver products and services, whether it's online, mobile, or having mobile financial planners or mortgage advisers who can be made available to customers.

Again, I keep going back to the first principle: that banks don't want to lose customers. They're waging a war for customers, so these decisions are made with a lot of thought and consideration. Obviously part of that is how to retain customers and ensure that they continue to be serviced, regardless of the manner in which they're serviced.

9:45 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

Do you think that you'll be going more and more to a model of bankers coming to us, to able-bodied and disabled people? I know that in larger business deals and so forth, they'll do that. Is that something that's on the horizon?

9:45 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

Give a very quick response, please.

9:45 a.m.

Vice-President, Employee Relations, Royal Bank of Canada

Teri Monti

We are certainly looking to expand our network of mobile advisers.

9:45 a.m.

Edmonton Griesbach, CPC

Kerry Diotte

Excellent.

9:45 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

Thank you very much.

That takes us to the end of this panel.

I want to thank all of you for joining us and contributing to our study on Bill C-81.

We're now going to suspend very briefly to bring in the next panel.

9:50 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

I'd like us to come to order. Please take your seats. Thank you.

Welcome back, everybody. Welcome to our second panel for today. I'm not going to go through the whole preamble from earlier with regard to the accommodations being made. I will just remind everybody that both French and English sign language is going on. As a result, and as a request from them, please keep your comments at a metered pace. If you are going too fast, I will interrupt you, so I apologize in advance. We just want to make sure that everyone is heard appropriately through the different accessible means.

Joining us here on our second panel from Accessible Media Incorporated is David Errington, president and chief executive officer.

From ARCH Disability Law Centre, we have Robert Lattanzio, executive director; and Kerri Joffe, staff lawyer.

From the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission, we have Scott Shortliffe, chief consumer officer and executive director. Joining him we have Marie-Louise Hayward, manager, social and consumer policy; and Adam Balkovec, legal counsel. Welcome, everyone.

We'll start this morning with opening remarks. Please keep the remarks to about five minutes. Again, keep a steady pace and don't worry too much about going a little over your time.

First, from Accessible Media Incorporated, we have David Errington, president and chief executive officer.

The next five minutes are all yours, sir.

9:50 a.m.

David Errington President and Chief Executive Officer, Accessible Media Inc.

Good morning, Mr. Chair and members of the committee. My name is David Errington, and I'm the president and CEO of Accessible Media Inc., or AMI. Thank you for inviting me to appear before you today.

AMI commends the government on tabling Canada's first federal legislation aimed at improving accessibility for people with disabilities. The objective of the proposed accessible Canada act, namely to enhance the full and equal participation of persons with disabilities in society, is very much in keeping with AMI's mandate.

AMI is a media company that entertains, informs and empowers Canadians who are blind and partially sighted. AMI's mandate is to establish and support a voice for Canadians with disabilities, representing their interests, concerns and values through accessible media, reflection and portrayal.

AMI is currently licensed by the CRTC to operate three television services: AMI-audio, AMI-tv and AMI-télé. All three services have been deemed by the CRTC to be of exceptional importance to obtaining the objective in paragraph 3(1)(p) of the Broadcasting Act, which provides the following:

programming accessible by disabled persons should be provided within the Canadian broadcasting system as resources become available for the purpose;

As a result, all three services have been granted mandatory carriage status as part of the basic television service by the CRTC.

AMI-audio is Canada's only English-language television audio reading service. It offers a variety of compelling stories and engaging original content to Canadians who are blind, partially sighted or otherwise print-restricted. AMI-audio's mandate is to deliver a steady and timely flow of information that is essential to the decision-making needs of our audience.

AMI-tv and its French language counterpart, AMI-télé, are television services that provide blind, partially sighted, deaf and hard-of-hearing Canadians with access to open-format described video and closed-captioned versions of popular programming, as well as original first-run content, in a manner that is inclusive for all.

For those unfamiliar with the term “described video”, or DV, it's a narrated description of a program's main visual elements, such as settings, costumes and body language. Descriptions are added during pauses in dialogue, and enable blind and partially sighted individuals to form a mental picture of what's happening in the program. While DV typically uses a separate audio track, AMI has pioneered the use of integrated described video, or IDV, whereby the identification of the key individual elements is incorporated into the pre-production, production and post-production phases of the original programs.

In addition, all the programming on AMI-tv and AMI-télé is provided in open-format described video with closed captioning. No special equipment or extra steps are required to access any of our television services, making them truly accessible 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

All three of our television services are the first of their kind in the world. These three services, along with our companion websites, mobile app, online media player, YouTube channel, and social media presence, provide blind, partially sighted, deaf and hard-of-hearing Canadians with access to entertainment, news and information programming that they would not otherwise be able to enjoy on platforms of their choice.

However, AMI is more than just a broadcaster. In order to address the evolving needs and expectations of blind and partially sighted Canadians and the changes within the audiovisual environment, AMI is involved in a multi-faceted company that creates, advocates, collaborates and innovates in order to enable accessibility to all media.

With regarding to creating, our television services focus on creating commissioned, original first-run Canadian programs that directly address issues of importance to blind, partially sighted and disabled communities. Without AMI's provision of this type of programming, these stories would not otherwise be told. These programs all provide positive on-air portrayal of blind and partially sighted individuals as hosts or subjects of the programs, and feature themes and material of particular relevance to blind and partially sighted individuals.

As a result, AMI has become a springboard for talent in the blind and partially sighted community, with approximately 78% of our on-air personalities being persons with a disability.

Regarding advocacy, AMI has become a leader in advocating on behalf of the blind and partially sighted community to domestic and foreign regulatory bodies, such as the CRTC and the disability advisory committee of the Federal Communications Commission, or FCC.

In addition, we provide opportunities for blind, partially sighted and disabled individuals to participate more fully in social, political and cultural life. For example, we hosted an accessible federal election town hall for the 2015 federal election, which encouraged blind and partially sighted individuals to cast their ballots and participate in a key aspect of our democracy.

On collaboration, we collaborate with numerous organizations, including the Canadian Association of Broadcasters, the Federal Communications Commission and, most recently, the World Wide Web Consortium to ensure that Canada's accessibility agenda is advanced both domestically and internationally.

We partner with other broadcasters in local colleges to teach integrated described video techniques, in the hopes that future generations of producers will regard accessibility as a fundamental component of production rather than a post-production afterthought.

We innovate. Through our innovation, we try to ensure that scientific and technological advances in accessibility are extended to blind and partially sighted communities. Our innovative and pioneering use of integrated described video has resulted in multiple awards. Together with the Canadian Association of Broadcasters and other organizations, we have created an award-winning online described video TV guide. We launched our first successful online media player for broadcasts in North America, and starting with our breakthrough live description of Toronto Blue Jays baseball games, we have described live events that were previously thought to be unsuitable for described video, opening a whole new world of possibility and enjoyment for our viewers.

We're also actively involved in developing and approving DV awareness and standards both within the Canadian broadcasting system and on the international scale. Together with the Canadian Association of Broadcasters and other organizations, we have created best-practice guides for DV and IDV production in both official languages.

In 2017 we were awarded the FCC Chairman's Award for advancement in accessibility for the integrated described video best practice guide. AMI was one of only four winners of this award, two others of which were Facebook and Amazon.

These innovations enable AMI and other broadcasters to improve the quality of their described video productions and to make them readily available to blind and partially sighted viewers. As evidenced from these examples, AMI's mandate is not just about accessibility but also about representation, reflection and positive portrayal of blind and partially sighted Canadians.

However, there is still more work to be done. The needs and expectations of the blind and partially sighted community with respect to media accessibility are undergoing the same profound shift as experienced in broader Canadian broadcasting systems. Like everyone else, these viewers are in search of high-quality content that speaks directly to their needs and interests and that is readily available on a variety of platforms.

According to the CNIB, approximately half a million Canadians are estimated to be living with significant vision loss that impacts their quality of life, and every year more than 50,000 Canadians will lose their sight. Moreover, CNIB predicts that the prevalence of vision loss in Canada is expected to increase nearly 30% in the next decade. This is due to the demographic shift caused by the aging population, with the population of Canadians aged 65 and older expected to double in the next 25 years.

In addition, there is a growing incidence of key underlying causes of vision loss, such as obesity and diabetes. The CNIB warns that without action, the number of people with sight problems in Canada is likely to increase dramatically.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

Excuse me, Mr. Errington; you're running at about seven and a half minutes.

10 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Accessible Media Inc.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

I'm wondering if you can just conclude quickly, and then maybe we can deal with some things in questions. Thank you.

10 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Accessible Media Inc.

David Errington

Sure. No problem. I'll just do the final part.

We are pleased that the CRTC has prioritized certain of these accessibility measures in their recent policy decisions. The CRTC has implemented a tiered approach to ramp up the amount of DV programming being provided by television broadcasters based on the size and resources of broadcasters. The CRTC has required certain television distributors to include in their annual returns certain information relating to the availability of set-top boxes, the penetration of set-top boxes, and the number of accessibility-related queries they receive. These measures are consistent with and perhaps even overlap some of the reporting requirements contained in Bill C-81.

Given the limited financial means of many blind and partially sighted individuals and the lifeline that television and media provide to these individuals, we believe the Government of Canada should ensure that accessible set-top boxes and remote controls are available for free or at a substantially discounted rate to blind and partially sighted individuals. Until accessible set-top boxes and remote controls become ubiquitous, there will continue to be a barrier to television programs for blind and partially sighted Canadians.

I appreciate the opportunity to present AMI's views on this important matter, and I will be pleased to respond to any questions you may have. Sorry for being long.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bryan May

Thank you.

Up next, from ARCH Disability Law Centre, we have Robert Lattanzio, executive director; and Kerri Joffe, a staff lawyer.

Welcome to both of you. Go ahead for five minutes, please.