Evidence of meeting #14 for Justice and Human Rights in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was c-9.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Kurt Holman Conservative London—Fanshawe, ON
Mr. Chair, I was really enjoying the speech that Mr. Jivani was giving. May I yield my time to allow the gentleman to continue with this speech?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
No. We'll continue with the speakers list if you don't want to speak.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Mr. Chair, I did not hear our colleague Mr. Jivani apologize, nor did I hear him withdraw his words. I therefore request that he withdraw his words and apologize.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Thank you, Mr. Fortin. That's exactly why I took his time away and moved to the next speaker. He refused to apologize. That's why I moved on.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I'm sorry. He refused to apologize. He refused to retract his comment, which is why I moved on to the next speaker.
We're back to Mr. Genuis.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
I was wondering if I'd be allowed to read a descriptive text that calls someone a hypocrite, or if that would also be deemed unparliamentary and illegal under the relevant legislation.
Since Mr. Jivani is coming up on the list again, I'll ask you to add me to the bottom of the list and strike my position for now.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I'll put it this way: Mr. Jivani is not going to speak again until he retracts those comments.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Okay. Then I would like to raise a question of privilege. It is not merely a matter of order but a matter of privilege that members be allowed to speak before committee.
Mr. Chair, you're relatively new in your position, but your authority as chair is not in right of you as an individual; it comes from the rules. It is a reflection of the office you hold. There have been multiple occasions today when you have not respected established rules. It is an established principle that members have a right to speak, and if you deprive members arbitrarily of the right to speak, end their time or deprive them of the floor, these matters are appealable directly to the Speaker of the House. Regrettably, I can't remember the specific standing order—someone will tell me in due course, and I know it's in there—but uniquely in the case where a member is cut off from speaking, members can appeal directly to the Speaker, who can overturn the judgments of a chair and nullify all subsequent proceedings.
In any event, this is a matter of privilege. Mr. Jivani is a duly elected member of Parliament. You're welcome to disagree with him, and Mr. Fortin is welcome to disagree with him, but he has a right to speak. There are plenty of instances where members.... I can think of when Mr. Erskine-Smith dropped a few F-bombs at a committee in the last Parliament, and he was encouraged to be more appropriate in his language, but he was not deprived of his rights as a member of Parliament. You cannot simply decide to deprive someone of their right to speak because you don't like what they said. That is a violation of their privileges.
I would encourage you to consider whether this is a matter touching on privilege, and if you find it is, I will be prepared to move the appropriate motion.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Mr. Genuis, let's do it this way. I've been in the position of chair of this committee for a week now. I've served as a committee chair for over six years. I notice you've never sat in the position of a committee chair.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
There's a reason for that, I suspect. Nonetheless, under the circumstances, suggesting I've denied anybody an opportunity to speak is verging on laughable considering we've been here for seven hours listening to people speak over and over again—this might be your 10th or 11th intervention; I've lost track—so it's an accusation with no merit.
Having said all that, I think the best course of action right now, since our resources end in a few moments, is to suspend this meeting for the day.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Chair, I've raised a question of privilege. You have to rule on the question of privilege.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
The meeting is suspended.
[The meeting was suspended at 11:25 p.m., Tuesday, December 9]
[The meeting resumed at 8:36 a.m., Thursday, December 11]
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Good morning, everybody. I'd like to resume the meeting.
There are a couple of housekeeping matters before we pick up where we left off. I'm not going to read through all of the usual pieces before we get going. I was going to say that people know how to behave, but maybe I won't say that. However, I do want to say thank you to our witnesses for joining us again and for being so incredibly patient the other night. It was a long night, and I expect nothing different today, frankly, so I'll say thank you in advance.
I have a speaking list, which I've carried over from last time.
Ms. Lattanzio, do you have your hand up for something? I'll get to the speaking list in a minute.
Liberal
Patricia Lattanzio Liberal Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
As we begin our day today, the meeting has been scheduled from 8:30 to 4:30 to pursue our study on Bill C-9, which is the combatting hate act. I hope that today we will be able to finish our clause-by-clause. There aren't many articles left. Canadians across the country have asked us to come up with legislation to tackle the issue of hate in this country, so I sincerely hope we'll be able to get through it.
As you witnessed in the last meetings, Mr. Chair, there have been—
Conservative
Liberal
Patricia Lattanzio Liberal Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC
—interventions non-stop, and quite frankly and quite clearly, there's been a lot of filibustering around this bill, for reasons beyond my comprehension. I sincerely hope that today, members opposite will, as you said in terms of comportment and behaviour.... I do not want to see what happened at the last meeting in terms of the issuing of insults and the making fun of members on this committee. I sincerely hope that decorum will be maintained today.
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Yes, I'll get to you.
Can I just say something off the top? Look, things got a little messy during the last part of the last meeting. I've spoken with a number of you individually. I don't want to have to cut people off or take the floor away from people.
We can stay here for days and days if people wish. All I'm asking is that people respect everybody else around the table. I don't want any name-calling or nonsense about people sitting beside people. Just cut all of that stuff out, please—that's all I'm asking. It will make my life a whole lot easier and yours a whole lot more enjoyable, and anybody who happens to be watching will have a whole lot more respect for all of us.
That's my ask for the day. I hope I don't have to discuss this again at any point.
Mr. Brock, you have a point of order.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON
Yes. I recognize that I am not first to be recognized for substantive comments. This is more of a housekeeping and scheduling issue.
Mr. Chair, I believe the original notice that I read yesterday had us going to 5:30 today. Ms. Lattanzio indicated 4:30. I would like clarification on that. I would also like clarification on whether or not we are sitting tomorrow. I would like clarification on whether we are sitting all next week. I would like clarification on whether we are sitting the following week, right to Christmas Eve. I would like clarification for the week between Christmas and New Year's Day. Furthermore, I would like clarification on whether you plan on sitting the week of January 5, the week of January 12 and the week of January 19, until we return and resume our winter and spring session.
Mr. Chair, if you could clarify that for us, that would be very helpful for our organizational planning.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I admire your work ethic, Mr. Brock.
Look, as you know, our ability to have meetings is largely dependent, in some circumstances, on resources being available. I have looked into those resources in the short term for tomorrow and next week. I don't have any response yet.