moved:
Motion No. 17
That Bill C-66, in Clause 13, be amended by replacing lines 13 to 15 on page 15 with the following:
“79. The Corporation may, pursuant to agreements made between the Government of Canada and the government of any province, undertake jointly with the government of the province or any agency thereof or with any public housing”
Motion No. 35
That Bill C-66, in Clause 34, be amended by adding after line 37 on page 21 the following:
“(3) The Corporation may not exercise any of its powers or functions under this section within the territorial limits of a province without having first obtained the agreement of the government of the province.”
Mr. Speaker, Bill C-66 is an important bill. It is intended to give new powers to the Canada Housing and Mortgage Corporation.
It is paradoxical, to say the least, that we are having to deal with a bill such as this. I think everyone understands that the federal government has absolutely no interest in housing.
Before introducing our amendments, I want to remind the House that the government made a commitment in the 1996 speech from the throne to withdraw completely from the housing sector. Government members with us today will remember that, at least I hope they do.
However, we find a paradox on reading the bill. We discover the government wants more space and more powers in the housing sector. It is totally incomprehensible. It is contradictory to say the least, and completely inconsistent.
If the bill were passed—and I certainly hope not, but we are sometimes at the mercy of majorities—it has all the potential to allow the federal government to establish a national housing allowance.
I asked the Minister of Public Works, who is responsible for the CMHC, whether it was not somewhat inconsistent that, in the throne speech, which is a commitment after all, the government said it wanted to withdraw from this sector, and that negotiations were even under way to transfer $1.9 billion to the provinces. The minister replied that, while that was so, there were some provinces where logic did not apply.
This attitude is a bit hard to understand. Our amendments, which I hope will be favourably received by the government, provide that, if the federal government takes action in the low cost, co-operative or non-profit housing sector in municipalities in Quebec, we hope that permission will first be required from the Government of Quebec and the National Assembly.
The bill contains certain provisions flowing from a clause such as this, particularly where aboriginals and student loans are concerned. We hope, through our amendments, to broaden the scope of what exists already on a smaller scale.
I wish to take this opportunity to ask the federal government, particular the government members here today—I am thinking of the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration—to bring pressure to bear so that the negotiations that have been going on with the Government of Quebec for over two years reach a successful conclusion.
There is something positively indecent about the federal government's proposal, and I will explain why.
As we speak, the federal government is spending $362 million annually in the housing sector, through various CMHC programs. But this is to completely ignore Quebec's demographic weight. If the federal government had to adjust its spending to reflect Quebec's demographic weight, it would be just over 24%, as everyone knows. It would then have to spend $480 million. The difference is $117 million.
Nor is it respectful of what used to be termed households with core housing needs. I would remind members that all the governments in Quebec, the one the Minister of Immigration belonged to, as did her friend Mr. Johnson, the government of Mr. Parizeau and the government of Mr. Bouchard, all these have made the same demands on the federal government as far as housing is concerned, namely that they receive a fair share, taking core housing needs into consideration. Although Quebec accounts for 24.60% of the population of Canada, it contains 29% of households in need of core housing.
This has been acknowledged by Mr. Ryan, Mr. Trudel, and all the housing ministers, one after another, in the National Assembly.
If Quebec had its fair share, taking into account the households in need of core housing, that would mean it would receive $567 million. I repeat, however, that as we speak what is being spent is $362 million. This makes no sense at all.
More ridiculous still, the Minister responsible for CMHC and member for Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, makes an offer to Quebec, offering it less than the CMHC spends annually. This makes little sense. He offers Quebec $289 million, while at this very moment $362 million is what is being spent.
I hope the voice of Quebec will be able to make itself heard in this cabinet, that the ministers will get some hold on themselves and loosen the purse strings a little. Housing is an important issue. The main cause of poverty is certainly the amount that our most disadvantaged fellow citizens have to pay in rent.
Even if there is no official indicator of poverty in Canada, the National Council of Welfare, along with Statistics Canada, considers a person poor, and below the poverty line if he or she is devoting 55% of income to basic necessities, i.e. accommodation and food.
We live in a society where there have never been so many poor, and in many cases, of such poverty. We should recall the slogan of the Liberal government in 1968, which called for a just society. This is how Pierre Elliott Trudeau's Liberals made their entry into government.
These people, who claimed to have a sense of fairness and to want to live in a fairer society, are becoming dramatically accustomed to living with a level of poverty that has never been so high. It is important the federal government give the provincial governments the money it will transfer so they have additional resources in the housing sector.
I cannot stress enough with the Liberal ministers that the voice of Quebec must be heard and negotiations must continue. There is no need for a bill like this. If the federal government wants to talk of housing, it will have the support of the opposition parties. I am sure it will have the support of the Progressive Conservative Party, the Reform Party and the New Democratic Party if it wants to make more money available to the provinces, which should be the real agents in the area of housing.
There is a major shortage of resources. However the federal government has a lot of money. After dumping responsibilities, it has a huge amount of money. In the fight against poverty, the least it could do is let the provincial governments, with Quebec in the lead, have some of it.
In all of Canada, as we speak, two provinces are working on housing development, that is, permitting public housing to be built. There is Quebec, with one of the best governments ever assembled in the National Assembly. Quebec has set aside $42 million for housing development. Another province has also done so: British Columbia.
I would ask the Liberal members to vote in support of our amendments, because it is in the interest of Quebec.
