Justice Committee on Dec. 9th, 2025

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

With regard to the BQ amendment, which replaces the offence so that it only covers symbols used by the terrorist entities listed under subsection 83.01(1), thereby removing Nazi symbols, SS bolts and other hate symbols from the bill, the amendment removes almost all of the hate symbols that communicate hate.

Communities have come forward and asked us to address Nazi symbols, as we heard through the testimony, and the other images used to intimidate people in public places. Groups have told us here in committee quite clearly that the problem they are facing is the open display of hateful symbols like the SS bolts.

Narrowing the offence, and this specific amendment, would ignore what they've asked for. Limiting the offence to listed terrorist entities would leave out many of the symbols that the Jewish, Muslim, Black, LGBTQ+ communities and others have told us are being used to threaten and harass them, and it is really going against the spirit of this bill.

The terrorist entity list is small and slow to update, and this approach would make the offence far less useful and far less responsive to what is actually happening on the ground and in our streets. We want this law to be practical for police and meaningful for communities that are affected. This amendment would weaken it to the point where it no longer meets that goal. For that reason, we will be voting against it.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you, Ms. Lattanzio.

I have Mr. Lawton, Mr. Brock and Mr. Baber.

Mr. Lawton.

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

I've cited a few times at this committee an instance from a couple of months ago in my riding that is very germane to this, which was that someone, under existing criminal laws, was arrested and charged for having a swastika mowed into their lawn. No separate offences in the Criminal Code and no additional police powers were required for that. This issue was another one of many crime stories that emerged in my riding.

I've had a great many conversations with police chiefs and frontline police officers, and when they talk about what they want, not one of them has said they want Bill C-9. They talk about wanting bail reform. They talk about wanting legislation like we've put forward in the jail not bail act, the legislation we have tried to move attention to in this very committee meeting, because there is a lot more consensus on it.

I find it shocking the Liberals will get up in the House of Commons—

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

I have a point of order.

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

—and accuse us of blocking bail work—

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Lawton, I'll give you the floor back—

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

—while denying the opportunity to get to it, Mr. Chair, and you're silencing me again—

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

No, I'll give you the floor back. We have a point of order.

Ms. Lattanzio.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Mr. Chair, again, there's a question of relevance here today. I think it's quite clear that the Conservatives do not want to proceed with Bill C-9. At every opportunity, they are invoking other pieces of legislation, which I'm hopeful we'll be able to get to if we can finish with the one before us. We are very much looking forward to dealing with the other pieces of legislation that are before this committee and that will be forthcoming in this committee, but today we should be concluding our work on Bill C-9.

It is very clear by the interventions that at every turn they are trying to stretch the time to not have to deal with this clause-by-clause study. It's very apparent. I would invite the Conservative members on this committee to move ahead so we can move to the study of other pieces of legislation.

If you keep this up, we'll never get to it.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Okay, we'll go back to you, Mr. Lawton.

I think it goes without saying that the sooner we get through this bill, the sooner we can get to the next bill. I don't think we need to repeat that over and over again.

Mr. Lawton, the floor is yours.

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

My point, and where it is germane, is that it's about community priorities and justice priorities, and I find it fascinating that the Liberal government is holding its own bail bill hostage and using that as leverage to force us to advance very bad legislation that will attack the rights of Canadians.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Housefather has a point of order, Mr. Lawton.

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

I'm sure he does.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Go ahead, Mr. Housefather.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

Mr. Chair, I question the relevance of this to BQ-2. This has nothing to do with BQ-2.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

I'm inclined to agree with you, Mr. Housefather. We've gone—

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

I cede the floor.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Brock, go ahead.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

I see what the Liberal members are doing, Mr. Chair. They say one thing to the community at large; they say one thing to the House, accusing Conservatives, including the parliamentary secretary herself, of deliberating blocking the study of Bill C-14.

I brought forth a unanimous consent motion that could have dealt with prioritizing bail and sentencing. To my colleague Mr. Lawton's point—

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Brock—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

I'm not done yet.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Brock, with all due respect, I really don't want to interrupt anybody. I don't—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

Then why are you interrupting me, Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Let me—